transgender women(?) Anonymous 9156
what are /b/'s thoughts on transgender mtfs? Do they consider them women? Should they be allowed access to women only spaces (after passing, before passing?), do you have any experiences good or bad online or offline with transgendered women?
This is probably bait since the general consensus here is that they're not women, it's been the general opinion here since day one.
No it was a sincere question, do you dislike trannies or do you not consider them women simply as a matter of biological essentialism?
Should women's bathrooms, swimming pools, clubs etc. institute mandatory genome sequencing for all members so we can detect trannies?
I personally don't "hate" transwomen, I just don't see them as women. They're a totally different category and denying that is ridiculous. Even if they indeed had "female" brains they'd still have been brought up as men, and have a totally different perspective on things, etc., not to mention the obvious body and hormonal differences and needs. I'm really glad that outing your gender gets you banned here because I'm tired of "as a transwomen I think…" just like I'm tired of "as a guy I think…"
I just wanna chill with my gals on here and that's it.
And as for my experiences with them:
I was personally attacked by someone who identified as a trans girl but he was so psycho I don't even know if he really felt he was one or not. Due to his whole life and history I think he was attention whoring but who the fuck knows.
That was just to answer your question if they are female or not. They're not and no matter how many surgeries they get or how many shots they take, they will never be female. I don't care what bathroom they use as long as they stay away from me but I feel the same way about regular perverted men. They're a small fraction of our population so trying to make them stay away from our bathrooms shouldn't really be one of our biggest concerns.
You'd think it would be obvious to anyone that transwomen aren't biologically women, but I guess that's not the case these days. They're obviously a different category, but if you met a woman(male) who had transitioned early, looked female, "acted" female, and had been socialised female and the like, is there any real reason they shouldn't be referred to as women or allowed into female spaces? Hypothetically speaking, if you met a new friend and thought they were female, and they turned out to be trans, would your opinion of them or the way you treat them change?>I was personally attacked by someone who identified as a trans girl but he was so psycho I don't even know if he really felt he was one or not.
I think this is a big problem too, a lot of trans identifying types are complete fucking psychos, or at the very least really strange. My only encounters with trans people IRL have been with pretty strange types that straight up don't look like females, very burly, heavy 5' o'clock shadow etc.>>9171
This is one attitude I think isn't very cool though, why the idea that these people are all perverted? I'm sure plenty of them are, but what about those that don't even have a sexual interest in women and prefer men?
>>9172>why the idea that these people are all perverted?
Maybe it was your reading comprehension or just my bad writing skills but no, I don't mean they are all perverted by default. I can't fucking know. Mentally ill, sure. But perverted as in rapist or molester idk.
I was talking about perverted men trying to take advantage of women in our bathrooms, not that all trannies are like that. To be fair with you the only times I remember seeing trannies in the bathroom they were talking together in a very loud and obnoxious manner but they didn't do anything aggressive obviously. Like I said before there are way worse matters going on that we have to deal with than having trannies in our public bathrooms.
Yeah, I agree. I think a big problem is it's not really a condition that's fully understood yet and there's probably a number of different pathologies that lead to it. For example, I'm sure Chris-Chan and Bruce Jenner and the like are just attention whoring or weird, but I'm sure there are also plenty of trannies who are basically stuck with this condition from birth and are forced to transition because it's the only way they can feel comfortable in their bodies. When it comes down to personal standards I just think if they look like a woman I'll treat them like one, if they don't then I'll pay lip service so as not to be bothered by them but not actually want much to do with them.
>>9172>>Hypothetically speaking, if you met a new friend and thought they were female, and they turned out to be trans, would your opinion of them or the way you treat them change?
I already said I don't hate them, so… No? But I'd never see them as women. Also I've never seen one who really passes IRL, they just like to think they do but you always know there's something "off". Maybe very rich people can afford it and in 20 years it'll be possible for the common folk but no, I have yet to come across one who "passes" so I doubt I'd be fooled like that if we got to the point of becoming friends.
to be fair if I was a tranny and passed 100% aside from my neovag I don't think I'd tell literally anyone IRL besides from people I was having sex with
You act like they're flying under the radar. Most do not pass well.
if most trannies passed there'd be no way of knowing, people only see trannies who don't pass - otherwise they just assume it's a normal woman
The thing is… They never pass in real life unless they are filthy rich and even the ones who are filthy rich end up looking like the obvious yet messy asf Gigi in the end with huge ass blowup doll "I was a man" lips.
Oh I meant to say funny not obvious lmao, idk why I typed obvious. Yeah Gigi is funny but a walking disaster.
yeah they're women but they shouldn't silence female people for talking about female problems that they don't experience
>>9184>otherwise they just assume it's a normal woman
Until they open their mouths to speak.
All of the trans people I know have done some legit weird shit before and after "coming out" so it's like ¬__¬ but I'm still with the idea that people can do what the fuck they want as long as;
1) it's not hurting anyone else
2) they actually make the effort with the "dream" they have.
You don't get to throw a dress on and grow your hair and be like I'M WOMAN NAO. Youtube tutorial exists. Being poor isn't an excuse IMO.
Video mega related.
Why are imageboards so obsessed with trans women? I know a few trans women irl (inb4 fuck off tranny, I'm not one myself) and not even they talk about this shit as much as people on image boards. I truly don't understand.
If you've ever talked to a trans woman, it's pretty clear they're women. The gender dysphoria they feel is real and painful to see. Nobody would go through the difficulty of transitioning just to be a pervert or for attention. I'm sorry some of you have had bad experience with people who use being trans as a sort of excuse to do gross things – that sounds horrible. Trans women just want to pass and not be assualted themselves.
It's just a reflection of what people think in general, not an imageboard related thing imo. Being anon just gives people confidence enough to say what they really think.
I don't think they are women, but I do believe dysphoria is real, but it should be treated a different way.
Being a woman or a man is not an innate thing, it is something you are socialized into, it's learned behavior and always very clearly needs to be learned by trans people, just like females and males learn and are taught. Many trans people confuse being feminine or masculine with being a man or a woman and think that makes them male or female. Destroying harsh gender stereotypes will likely bring the trans population down considerably.
Being a male or female however is an innate thing and having dysphoria or feeling the 'wrong sex' is a mental issue.
I think that trans is a blanket term for a few social and mental disorders, but I think mutilating them is wrong. Even with the inclusion of hormones, SRS is cosmetic at best and is only a temporary self esteem boost. I will say that once science can just brain swap people, I will consider them to be whatever sex their body is, but that still doesn't give them that gender.
I don't hate them, but I don't think mtt belong in feminist groups or in women's spaces. I also don't think the concept of trans should be with lgb, because our understanding of what trans is has changed.
I have had some bad irl experiences including with a friend who was a lesbian turned trans due to depression who has now since become a suicidal alcoholic.
>>9217>Nobody would go through the difficulty of transitioning just to be a pervert or for attention
That's such a shitty, Tumblr-tier argument though. Being a victim is a badge of honor in certain spaces, and if there are white people pretending to be poc (but white passing!) then sure there are regular people pretending to be trans. Also, depending on your level of degenerate you could be quite mentally ill…>>9231>lesbian turned trans
Those are the worst, it makes me so sad. I've seen so many butch lesbians who were convinced they were actually trans men… it's depressing.
Yes, some people actually enjoy being victims. That happens in so many paths of life and it's not exclusive to some of the trans community. People do crazy stuff for sexual pleasure for example (see woman who wanted to go limbless, or did, I don't remember)
I support them. Their existence doesn’t hurt my experience of living in society as a woman in any form.
crystal.cafe is a nice and comfy place with no boys allowed, because most internet boys are loud and rude and annoying and scream "Look at my dick I hate jews women exist only for breeding." people smart enough to not do that in this space are considered girls, because they are remaining anon and anon on cc is a girl. in other words, they are already girls here.
for Women's Spaces, I think it depends on the space. a trannie who has just discovered that she wants to attain womanhood needs a different type of Women's Space than a pregnant woman needs a different type of Women's Space then a rape victim who had an abortion and feels shitty about it. Women are also much less likely to beat the shit out of someone who knows they dont pass and just wants to go pee, and I think less people having the shit beat out of them is better.
as a girl who can't get pregnant, I feel like I'll never be a woman, even though I know that plenty of women never do. most trannies, like me, are doomed to asymptotically approach womanhood, never catching up, because of a stupid quirk of genetics. I could easily take my pain out on them and push them down (at least I'm more of a woman then those freaks) but that would be wrong. the truth, for me, is that I can't hate or denounce someone who just wants the same thing I want.
I used to identify as afab trans masculine genderthing and got to know lot of trans people through that.
I don't want to be a dick but I am absolutely fed up with this trans bullshit.
I know some trans women I find ok I guess but all the trans people, even those who "just want to live their lives" have some issues. If they're not young queer theory assholes, they're middle aged perverts. There's maybe only one trans girl who seems relatively normal but she has some issues too like I said, mainly constantly fooling around with some old perverted men with dick girl fetishes which is kinda sad.
Anyway I admit I am completely fed up with trans women and having to walk on eggshells around them, everything is about their validation, their needs, their wants. This is a problem with pretty much every damn trans person I know but holy shit did I constantly have to apologize for being evil afab that's flaunting my privilege over my poor trans sisters.
I don't even want to go to the sexual entitlement issues because it's just fucking baffling, again this is not just issue with trans women but I hear this from the other gender people constantly too.
I don't know I want to be nice and accepting, I understand that trans women really do not lead easy lives but I've just gotten really tired and bitter during these years I have been involved with this shit.
(Samefagging, I just want to say I'm not just talking about online spaces but stuff and people I know in real life)
They should fuck off, stay in their own spaces, and stop reacting like 13 year olds on Tumblr whipping out appropriated ebonics and Rupaul quotes just because someone doesn't want them around. It makes it that much more difficult to take them seriously.
I'm sorry about your experiences anon, that sounds exhausting. It's absurd that you had to constantly apologize for your "AFAB privilege" – I would be pissed if I had to do that and burn out fast. Was this in more public spaces or private groups, and do you live in a large city or a smaller one? You don't have to answer the questions if you don't want to, I'm just curious because this sounds so different from what I've experienced.
I don't see an issue with trans people wanting to be identified as their transitioned gender, and I have no problem recognizing them as such, granted they are at least like, 40% passable.
I have these two teams friends, they both go by Tara (though one spells it Terra) and they both met last year.
One is tiny, like 26, cute and totally passable if she stays current on shaving and stuff.
On is 6'1, 52, and looks like Rambo in a pink dress. We call one "Pretty Tara" and when we don't mean her, we say "no the other one." I mean, never around or to them, but my point is, that's the exact way we'd talk about two "natural women" too, so I don't see a difference.
Y'all are a bunch of judgemental assholes.
Spoiler alert: it's the internet. People are judgemental irl as well, they just feel more free to judge online.
I don't live in North America. This city is considered big where I live but it would be small by USA's standards. These things are mixture of online and offline space, private and public, people I only know from online and people I know irl.
The people I know irl have private chatrooms and blogs where some of this stuff has happened, some have happened in private parties irl, some in more public spaces like some queer happenings.
I think the biggest issue is that most of these people are just miserable. Majority of trans people I know have had underlying mental health issues, and I guess in some cases when transitioning (or changing pronouns depending of the type of trans they are) didn't fix their issues they kind of get obsessed finding something which would "fix" them? Like this one trans man I know, he seems to kind of think that if only he found a (cis) boyfriend he would finally be happy and validated, he keeps complaining about his loneliness and cis gays and how finding a boyfriend as a trans guy is so difficult.
Or some trans women, who have been years on hormones still don't pass, they've gotten obsessed over some niche passing politics things, passing privileges, get more sensitive about cis sexism because I guess getting everyone around them to say that women can have beards or adams apples and stuff like that makes them feel better.
Its impossible to help these people because you're xphobe and ableist or something else. Trying to say that you know guilt tripping your twitter mutuals with suicide and making your mental well being their responsibility because they happened to like some legit harmless tweet is rather abusive and the kind of that behavior will just drive people away from you is out of question. Or some other similar situations.
There's supposed to be this very tight knit queer community of comrades but honestly people can't wait to get to cannibalize others. There was this call out thread where people could snitch stuff from other people's social media, like if they said or did something problematic on some chat or their fb or twitter you could bring the issue there where they could be "called out in public".
One trans man I know acts like a feminist gift to this world but it's obvious he hates women and loves attacking them over the most minor shit, used to always bully this legit mentally ill woman about say books she liked her boyfriend and he brought that stuff irl too. Surprisingly this started happening after this woman had slept with him and then rejected him.
There's just tons of different shit that made the spaces I was/am in fucked up. I have met very cool people too, but it all kind of gets over shadowed by this shady shit. It's just that there are these social dynamics that fester abusive behavior, and I won't be surprised if/when we have our own abuse scandal in our hands.
Hey call me judgemental but if you wanna trade you can take my place listening to trans woman lecturing me about how sexual harassment is worse for trans women because they weren't used to it compared to cis women who are used to being harassed from our childhoods and can't anymore feel so bad about it
trannies arent human much less women
Anon, I barely hang out with any trans people myself and only one boy from my old high school class turned out like this but don't you think that's a bit cruel?
Deep down they are human same you or me or whatever.
Sure with today's tumblr culture like >>9601
said, it almost feels like everyone wants to create more drama and is so hypersensitive that they become impossible to hang around without brewing anxiety, can't take any fucking jokes at all, but I feel like there are plenty of trans people with their heads screwed on right and just want to exist doing the things they like doing.
Like you, I just start to wonder what the fuck is going on with trans people in sports who don't transition and think it's their civil right to let them crush the competition or fail behind because the way their bodies are, there is no fairness in sport. The problem I have with this attitude in general is that they are egalitarian but relative.
They preach validating everyone but get real fucking nasty when someone tries to peer beyond their black and white mentality. And in public they say that everyone in the LGBT community is equal when everyone knows that there are indeed prejudices and in-groups inside.
But that's no excuse to let people call them abominations of nature.
I went to a crazy high school with loads of gay/trans/whatever kids, and regarding trans kids in particular the ones who didn't lend their whole identity to it and acted normally were fine. I only knew of one trans girl, I didn't even know she was trans until my friend told me, she was pretty quiet and
nerdy, she kept to herself.
There were some trans kids that really annoyed me back in the day, but they were all MTF, they would just go too far in their social media posts "this BOY just got HIS drivers license today uwu. #transdriver #transboy #transuniverse"
I think that social transitioning is totally possible, but no surgery can ever change your body into the opposite sex.
The media wants us to think trans-women are normalised and accepted, but they're really not and never will be.
>A woman who asked to be seen by a female nurse when she went for a smear test was 'embarrassed' when she was allocated a person with 'stubble and a beard'.
Upon being called in for the procedure, the patient said she was 'distressed' to discover that the nurse was biologically male.
When she pointed out the mistake, the nurse responded that their gender was not male and that they were transsexual.
In the end, the patient decided not to go ahead with the intimate procedure and complained to the NHS.
>She told The Sunday Times that it was 'weird where somebody says to you "my gender is not male" and you think: "well, what does that even mean? You're clearly a man!"'
The patient described the nurse as having an 'obviously male appearance…close-cropped hair, a male facial appearance and voice, large number of tattoos and facial stubble.'
She added: 'People who are not comfortable about this are presented as bigots and this is kind of how I was made to feel about it.'
>>9217>The gender dysphoria they feel is real and painful to see. Nobody would go through the difficulty of transitioning just to be a pervert or for attention.
Except they very definitely would. There are countless stories of people who pretend to be sick for years just for attention or mothers who would poison their own children for sympathy garnered by having a "sick" child. The fact is that trans people are inherently mentally ill and it isnt a leap to assume attention seeking behaviors consistent with disorders like hpd would also come with gender dysphoria.
They are like the kid in high school that thought they were a character in Naruto. Except they actually became that character and their astigmatism went in full throttle.
They are satanic and obsessed with us and obsessed with destroying us
Sisters, look at this and tell me if this isn't creepy as hell http://www.virtualffs.co.uk
Also, is this site run by a woman?
Would any of you want to start a YouTube channel with me to spread the word out?
I don’t consider them women. A lot of people itt really hit the nail on the head.
I mean not "with me" with me. But just interested in the idea of it.
That site isn't creepy. The site owner is making money providing a simple service. Only thing creepy are the perverts sending in photos, aroused by the anticipation of seeing themselves as ''women''.
>>9670>>They are satanic and obsessed with us and obsessed with destroying us
I don't ~like~ trannies or whatever, but this made me laugh because it's an exaggeration. I don't think they, as a group, have anything against
the female sex. But yeah they are mentally ill, obviously, and delusional.
Don't start trying to spread hate against trannies here again though, that shit went out of control way too many times already lol
OKAY. But I'm a girl so why should my opinion be irrelevant
Also they want to invade our spaces and rename pregnant woman as pregnant people so tell me again why they aren't out to destroy us
I didn't say your opinion is irrelevant, I told you to don't start grouping people to go hate on trannies again because we've had like three or four tranny hate shitpostingfests that were spreading all over the boards.
And yeah I do agree that's retarded ASF and mental, but I don't think the majority of trannies is actually trying to fight us or whatever defines us. They're very self centered.
They don't get criticism though. They don't get nearly as much criticism in a day that I have gotten in a lifetime. Why are you protecting them?
>>9679>They're very self centered.
Yes, narcissism. Narcissism can be dangerous. We see this now, how they are trying to deny women and CHILDREN their safety to please their own fetish. Give them the chance and they will go as far as they can.
Just because I was raised to be heavily religious you think you have the right to mock me? I am actually athiest but because I was literally sexually assaulted while I was baptized (I was baptized as a Catholic when I was a baby and then baptized again & SEXUALLY ASSAULTED when I was baptized again as a Christian) I am always going to be influenced by my religion I was socialized to have. We should hate trannies
I'm definitely not ~protecting~ them, I'm the person who posted the chromosomes and Jim Carey jsyk.
Well, and I hate typical slutty behaviour due to being raised in a very conservative family, but I don't go out saying we should kill all sluts and that they should die and that they're taking away all men. That's retarded. You need to base your opinions on facts if you want to discuss something so currently relevant such as trans people. They're mentally ill and they're not women and they should stop with the facade because no one believes that shit and they don't either, but being hateful because you were raised religiously is plain retarded and won't make much of an argument against anyone who fights for trannies because you yourself should know as an atheist that religion should stay out of this type of business.
I agree with you. You've changed my opinion. Thank you
no one said to kill anyone.
>>9679>I don't think the majority of trannies is actually trying to fight us or whatever defines us. They're very self centered
nta, but that's more evidence that they are or would be. trannies start as insecure men who are too scared of other men to get them to change so they switch to being insecure women, who know they can shout women down to get all of their self centered egotistical needs catered to. so much so that they turn other women against us.
I don't think they're ACTUAL women, but I think they deserve to be treated as such.
Why would they deserve to be treated as women if they are not women? To amplify delusions? They need respect and proper treatment, not more lies.
I´m studying in a fairly small village in Northern Europe (which is pretty open minded and accepting of LGBTQ+ people) and have on three occasions run into the same (and only) trans-woman in the campus bathroom.
Lucky for me, I already knew he was trans when it first happened, because he´s enormous. Way past 6ft, probably obese and absolutely hideous. But worst of all, he doesn't´t do anything to pass. His hair is short, he has facial hair and he wears baggy and plain clothes from the men´s section. It was just me and him in there and had I not read his cry for attention in the news paper a few weeks prior (about how he was going to kill himself last semester, but then got friends or something and that saved him), I would never guess that he was trans and I would probably freak out.
I don´t mind trans people, but they do generally annoy me, like this dude. How am I supposed to take you and your "gender" seriously when all you do to try to pass is put up one picture of yourself on IG with this hideous and obnoxious pink lipstick? It bothers me how much space some of them take up and how easy it is for them to just scream "TRANSPHOBE" or "TERF" at people who are questioning some of their behaviors. Like, I haven´t spoken to any of my friends here about this dude on campus and the bathroom situation because I don´t want them to think I´m transphobic for being annoyed by him.
(Sage for blogpost)
^ >realizes this isn´t lolcow
do we even sage here?
You don't have to, the board is slow and it was kind of on topic so
Yeah, we sage but this thread was already in the first page anyway, and we're pretty small so no one really cares or gets angry if you sage or don't sage.
I hear you, anon. There are things that bother me when it comes to transwomen invading women spaces and not trying to pass and calling attention to themselves/being obnoxious, but I fear speaking about them because I don't want to be labeled as a transphobe. Even if you're not being hateful many people will see you as one just because you said something negative about trans people.
do any of you have any opinions on Magdalen Berns? (YT: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvTTakI97sQ4SkMnsH8r0qQ
I think she´s one of the most vocal "terfs" and she has some interesting points and opinions, though I do feel like she is painting things a little too black and white sometimes. Her main arguments usually revolves around how trans women can never be women, that they invade female spaces and the biological (sometimes social) differences between the genders.
this. i honestly feel bad for trans people because they're being pushed by their insecurities.
I think misgendering on purpose is a really shitty thing to do and I sympathize with them having to go through the pain that comes with gender dysphoria and all that.
With that being said, I just hate it that many trans make a total mockery out of actual women. Their hyper-feminine, old fashioned, grossly stereotypical highly offensive behaviour makes me livid. All these decades trying to break down harmful gender roles and these people come in and confirm that born males still think of women as walking onaholes with house-keeping functions, even if they identify as such. I hate it that whenever a trans woman talks about what being a woman is they just start spewing out all of this trash that has absolutely nothing to do with people who were born female.
I will also never accept to call myself "cis" because that implies that I accept the roles that society actively and persistently pushes on me. There's very little in me that has to do with the female ""gender"", I was just literally born a female and ever since then was subjected to all the pressures that come with it. I'm not calling myself "cis" when I don't feel any gender, I see gender theory almost as a religion. I'll accept their views but won't let them push them on me.
I think it's because they genuinely worry and are constantly nervous if any of their natural behaviour is as "feminine" or "female" so they constantly adhere to very very stereotypical molds. They're terrified of their natural behaviour as being masculine so they behave untrue to themselves and what's comfortable for them because deep down this issue should be treated as a mental health one and not a civil rights one.
I think we shouldn't transition them and just allow them to be more comfortable with their bodies and behaving girly.
Trans people in general can't talk about breaking down gender stereotypes if the majority of them stick very very closely to them even if it's gender nonconforming for their natal gender.
Girls can wear pants or even dress in masculine style and are still seen as girls no matter what they do because they are simply women but transgirls can wear pants and not force themselves to constantly check their behaviour for ultra femme and are still thought as boys.
When it comes to getting rid of gender entirely, I don't entirely agree because it gets rid of all the shit that women had to go through and agree with you that calling them "cis" equally implies they have caused as much damage as men have to women. Like this binary damage is the exact same so like you I entirely agree, I don't have to use their language nor do they, mine so I will never call myself "cis".
i dont have a problem with trans ppl tbh
It's a weird subject because the transgirls that are chill just identify as girls and you'd never know. The issue is more with questionably passing girls who act like anime traps or the older totally non passing sorts who are just super aggressive. They deal with a lot of shit so a lot of them turn out sort of weird, but I wouldn't say they're all bad eggs. Some genuinely do just transition and then live life normally.
So yeah, I see them as women but it's moot point because the saner girls tend to blend in. It's tough online though because you have to pick between opening the gates totally to transwomen which means getting a lot of really shitty fetishists, or totally excluding them which means leaving out some genuinely cool people.
What "chill" and "sane" transwomen do you personally know? Seriously. I've never met ONE and I'm quite friendly IRL and not afraid to say hi. They are always loons, unfortunately. Also we always know they're men or at least there is something off. Or are you trans friends so rich they can manage to pass easily due to lots of surgeries they got at a young age or something?
I know a girl from my class in school who was taking HRT through classes then just started presenting female after she left. We keep in touch and she's a really sweet girl, works as a barista while she studies. You'd never know. Same goes for the other girl I know who was outed by a mutual "friend" who knew her before. We cut her out but we stayed friends, and again one of the nicest people you'd meet. She's a dweeb but really into fashion and makeup.
They both look great and I'm often jealous how nice their skin is and they just generally put a lot of care into their appearance. Neither has had surgeries but one is planning facial stuff, but I don't think she needs it.
I feel awful reading a lot of the posts in this thread because they're such normal, good natured people. I think it just comes out of seeing crazies on twitter or whatever.
Honestly you're probably one of the few lucky ones. Look at this thread, most of us have been in horrible situations with transwomen and that's why this stereotype is strong and alive. I am glad you managed to find good ones, but they're not the majority.
gender's a scam in general tbh. there's no meaningful difference between men and women other than what's socialized into us, so i don't see the point in denying people womanhood.
there's crazies out there for sure, but that goes for any group of people.
I agree to some extent. I won't say "men are tougher" and "women cry a lot" because those things are usually bollocks, and we have been socialized to be very different and it shows. I don't want to go full Tumblr but the problem is, for the most part, with the current gender roles being so strict in terms of behavior. I do think most
women have a natural tendency to X and men to Y, but those aren't rules.
I'm open-minded regarding trans people. Plenty of loonies but also quality people who suffer from mental illness and are trying to deal with it the best they can. I've seen only plenty of nice trans people (including a transwoman who looks rather gender nonconforming - comfortable clothes, no make-up etc. despite being on HRT) I will never discriminate because of that.
Having said that, the transwoman that I have been friends with for a few months was quite a case.
>She was extremely egocentrical. She took everything I said as a chance to whine about her trans issues and her dysphoria. When I shown her a photo of my boyfriend (that I have just gotten with), all she said was 'he has a much more feminine build than me! i wish i had such small sholders! waaaaaah'.
>She knew that I was extremely needy, depressed and emotionally broken and yet she didn't give a fuck about me finally finding a happy relationship even though being alone for years made me want to kill myself.
>Months before I met my bf, she got jealous when I started to get serious with a guy from tinder. The romance dwindled before anything happened (he was looking for a ons and not a ltr). She asked me to be her girlfriend - as it turned out in next few days, without regard for my feelings. It turned out she wasn't attracted to me at all and didn't want to hug or kiss me. She wasn't even able to end it. Luckily I wasn't in love with her, I liked her and found her pretty so decided to take the chance. It was really hurtful when despite our 'girlfriends' status she continued to treat me like a friend. Basically she decided to snatch me from a 'dating market' (sorry for the retarded phrase) so nobody else could be with me even though she was not attracted or interested in anything beyond friendship.
>She always criticised me for liking tacky pink stuff (like fluffy bunny keychains) and black/alternative clothing. I realize that my clothing choices are controversial, but the point of being friends is supporting and accepting each other. I didn't really like her clothes style, but I thought it fit her well and I wanted her to be able to enjoy 'female' clothes and express herself.
>Also criticised me for sucking at being woman - not knowing much about make-up, having nails sloppily painted etc. You know, the classic 'you were BORN a woman, how come you don't know the stuff???'
>was mad at me for not asking her to come to another city for a gig of a band that I love, but most people either criticise or don't care about. I apologised (as I had no idea she liked them) and told her I will let her know if I go to another concert. When Lana Del Rey was playing (which I knew she liked) I invited her to come with me. She didn't give a fuck. Instead, she started her usual program of whining without accepting any solutions.
>she was into bdsm (I'm LIGHTLY into it to, but not really the hurtful stuff - just bits of domination and bondage). She tried to pressure me (along with a guy she tried to set me up with) into getting tied to a cross and getting my ass spanked even though she was aware I wasn't into doing things in public and with people I'm not in love with (at the time I was in a bad mental state and thought being abused by a lover is ok, I wanted to use BDSM as self-harm method).
>the guy she tried to hook me up with was in a poly relationship. I told her I'm not ok with that. She told me that NOBODY ever loves anyone enough to stays faithful so why care? According to her it was ok to settle on someone basically cheating on you with your full knowledge. She had a really low self-esteem and believed that shit.
>as mentioned above - she was a serious whiner. You know the type of people who are depressed but when you tell them to go to shrink to medicate the illness away, they pull some bullshit excuse and continue with their whining? She was the type. Despite taking HRT she was torn between presenting as a woman and staying a man. It was obvious to me that she needed depression medication and a psychoterapy (either helping her accept herself as a transwoman or effemninate, bisexual guy). According to her, there was nothing that could help her - but she also didn't want to try. It was always 'oh, if only i was a woman', 'if only i had smaller shoulders', 'im just a piece of shit weirdo, nobody will love or accept me', 'if only i had enough money for facial surgery', 'why are other transgirls passing so much better?'. All of this are valid issues if you are trans. The problem was her negative attitude. She didn't give a fuck about me emotionally supporting her in every way possible.
Imagine someone that tries to fight you everything you tell her something nice ('you are pretty and would look lovely in this dress!' 'YOU HAVE SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR EYES, I LOOK LIKE SHIT, WILL NEVER PASS'). It gets draining damn fast. Again, it's not even a problem she was having those issues but that she was rejecting every solution in favor of staying in the same damn situation and pitying herself.
When I was feeling lonely about my lack of love life, I started going on tinder dates. While I haven't found my bf there, at least I was gaining new experiences, becoming less awkward and at least trying to change my situation. The experience prepared me for meeting with my bf after we ran into each other on reddit, so in the end, it was helpful.
Anyone feels like explaining why some people - male, female, trans or whatever - prefer to whine instead of doing something to change what hurts them?
>the cherry on top is sexist bullshit she was spewing, like 'women have it easier cause they can get sugar daddy and make money with their pussies', 'women have stronger orgasms! you are so lucky'. She suddenly turned deaf when I tried to tell her that most women don't want to be prostitutes, how horrifying the sex industry is and that plenty of women never experienced orgasm because of how shit their bfs/husbands are. Despite having EXTREMELY famely body language, face etc. she seemed to know nothing about living as a women beyond what she learned from porn.
Our friendship ended when I couldn't ignore more of her self-pitying bullshit and told her to get over herself and go seek medical help. She never replied to me. Fun fact: everyone who cared about her suggested seeing a shrink at least for her depression. She preferred to listen to a girl who didn't give a fuck about her beyond sexually, so of course she didn't care about her mental health.
My ex-friend was an incredibly unhappy, self-destructive and egocentrical person, but I truly wish her the best. I hope she finally finds peace and self-acceptance that she needs. She was in true pain, as annoying and stupid she might have been.
Stumbled upon this gem today.
Every post in this series is terrible, but this takes the cake. Cause fuck women struggling with gender expectations and discrimination at workplace, now only transwomen matter!https://gamecola.net/2014/02/disregard-canon-acquire-representation-naoto-shirogane-is-a-transman/
>>10342>so i don't see the point in denying people womanhood.
Because "womanhood" isn't a sorority that members can choose or opt out of, it's a biological reality for humans born who are born female. You can say that men should be allowed to express femininity and I'll agee with you, but that doesn't make them women. Unless you think femininity is intrinsically tied to being a woman, in which case you sort of negate your previous statements about gender.
This again. When Persona 4 was a big thing with Naoto as well as Dangan Ronpa's crossdressing boy character - Chihiro - were big things, people on Tumblr basically went balls to the wall crazy with the trans stuff.
If I wanted to use one of their buzzwords for what these sods are doing, I'd say - whitewashing.
What they are doing is ignoring culturally dependent misogyny or misandry because the characters are in their words, cis. Trans are the ultimate struggle to them that eclipse everything else. Apparently we must drop every other human rights issue for their sake. They are painting over an incredibly Japanese narrative with a highly American-centric belief which is racist in it's own way. I just want them to straight up say, I don't care about what issues Japanese women and men face because I am a middle class slactivist. I am so selfish and possessive that it must only be about me.
They are so self absorbed, they cannot relate to a character that doesn't reflect them because they just don't care.
If you want transgender characters in Japanese media, I's suggest the waitress in Catherine or Final Fight's Poison.
What makes tumblrinas angry is that these transgirl characters experience no or little discrimination, at least from my remembering.
They simply exist as transwomen characters who have no hamfisted "discrimination is bad" platitude. Hence they cannot circlejerk about it when trans characters just exist living as normal people.
these are mentally ill men, and it's a travesty that doctors/surgeons will provide them with """treatment""" despite a complete lack of evidence that it treats anything, as the pre and post suicide rate remains constant.
actually there is evidence, to the contrary. it actually was researched and studies showed the increases in suicide etc.
trans isn't even a thing in japan
I'm against the current treatment given to trans people (cut off balls, inject hormones, remove boobs) but Japan is so backwards in many aspects despite all the high tech and all … I'm not disagreeing with anyone here, I'm just making a semi related comment.
I really can't see trans being a thing in Japan. Even being gay isn't widely socially acceptable there yet despite yuri and yaoi anime.
the current 'treatment' only usually happens in places that accept the extreme trans narrative or countries that outlaw homosexuality.
What western country won't let a guy chop off his balls if his psych says he's a girl inside? I've personally seen that happen in North America, South America and two European countries.
idk, i dont see any singular experience of this so-called biological reality which makes it significant enough that i desire to categorize people based solely on that. all women experience womanhood differently, often vastly differently, so i don't see the point in excluding someone from it based on their genitals.
i'm mostly dreaming of humanity reaching a more evolved state where we do away with gender altogether, but that doesn't happen overnight. in the mean time, i really don't care if people born with a dick decide they're actually a chick, or the reverse. i'm not super invested in them, either, but i don't take issue with it.
Trans people in Japan definitely do exist, they're simply very underground and the culture is nothing like we know from modern SJWism.
Hell, there is an anime/manga named Hourou Musuko which is about a boy who wants to be a girl and a girl who wants to be a boy but ends up being fine with living as a woman.
Aya Kamikawa is a Tokyo figurehead who is the first transwoman to be in the political limelight.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aya_Kamikawa
This university is changing it's stance to possibly accept trans people.https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/09/19/national/social-issues/japans-womens-colleges-grapple-with-shifting-views-on-gender/
Japan simply isn't the complete collectivism individuality quashing hivemind you believe it truly is. Just because you don't see trans people in Japanese mainstream culture or that they get bashed, it doesn't mean they don't exist and that there aren't people in Japan with sex dysphoria.
The problem is how we should treat this issue and the trans political climate in Japan is entirely different from the self entitlement and useless shitflinging in the west.
You sound like the kind of men who believe that Japan has no Feminist movement because their attitude isn't the same as the west.
Trans people in Japan have an entirely different relationship with the public eye, most just want to live their lives quietly and don't do the tumblr thing of microaggresshuns.
The only thing I want to know is how you know you're from the other gender inside. How do they know they're trans? How do people actually find that out?
All the stories I have read never seem to make much sense. It's always "I felt more comfortable with girls", "I liked dolls/cars/whatever", and "I didn't like having a peepee", but lots of ~cis~ children have phases like these. I'm not saying transgenderism isn't real because I am not a psychologist, but many of these cases could simply be seen as not confirming to the standard gender rules and feeling weirded out by your own body for several reasons. I personally remember a girl who was very unhappy for not having a penis and wanted to be like her brothers who could pee standing and all. Sounds like something small, but it makes a lot of difference when you're a child and it gets in your head. You can also feel the other gender gets more attention and feel like you want to be like them, or worse things like sexual abuse which can make you hate the sex you are, having a strong role model from the opposite gender and a weak one from yours (someone you aspire to become like, and someone you'd hate to become) and even internalised homophobia in some cases, which would make you want to belong to the other sex so you'd be "straight".
Just my two cents.
I have the same views.
Most gender noncomforming children, even those who seem trans just turn out being lesbian or gay. It's reaching puberty and feeling sexual feelings for the same gender, that makes them realize they were gay.
However, 20% of those turn out being actually trans. Even the best gender doctors in the world can't predict who will stop insisting they're trans and those who will persist.
Which is why it's a stupid idea to transition children who barely know anything about themselves and let them run away with this identity model that the Internet feeds.
Many of the reasons you listed are entirely correct for why people mistakenly identify as trans.
Some transgirls believe the "woman is life on easy mode" meme and get drunk on the stereotype of a female body being a piece in the sexual capita market, who have low self esteem.
They could never get sex as a male so they think if they resemble a female, they can have all of the sexual attention, possibly love if they want. This is just an imaginary version of a woman that those men objectify and believe.
"Male life hasn't gone the way I want it to. Life as a woman seems like a shiny novelty."
So they co-opt a gender identity for all the wrong reasons. Some are just perverts who get erections from gender transformation fantasies and take on the troons label so they can continue to be deviants and cry transphobe if told to stop.
Most transboys just want to escape the biological reality and sexism that comes with being born female which isn't really a valid reason to make such a drastic change of who you are.
Many who identify as trans or non-binary, may just have normal body issues that every man or woman goes through. When this gets conflated with eating disorders and mental illnesses, they can easily mistake body dysmorphia for sex dysphoria.
Because these kids want to fit in, they can start to truly believe they are trans when they are socialized to become so.
Because life as a teenage girl is so hard, you can easily find a group whose common interest is trans…ness, a common enemy as well as feel special, unique and different.
I also curious as to what separates a small phase from a lifelong question to find the answer to.
I'm not especially interested in trans issues but this was pretty interesting tbh, thanks for the link.
>>10597>“Gender essentialism” is the theory that our gender differences are innate, universal, and—according to transphobes—biological. Atlus' games are rife in essentialism. Erica will always be a man according to Atlus, so she is still treated as such. Naoto's desire for gender reassignment is deemed irrational and potentially damaging because, really, he'll always be a woman.
This is the truth though and there is nothing hateful or fearful about it.
this. also most things in >>10496
are western interpretations.
Whoever wrote that article doesn't know much about Atlus and barely played Persona 4. Everytime people talk about LGBT representation in Atlus games they pretend that only the same 5 people worked on everything (everytime people say "why is there a gay option in P2 but not in P5? it makes no sense" it's not the same people who wrote these games, duh) and that Persona is the only series made by Atlus ever. I can see why some people could complain about representation in Persona 4 if they mention Kanji and/or Yosuke but not really when it comes to Naoto. This type of gamers tend to misinterpret so many dialogues in games and interviews by the writers or developers to make Atlus and sometimes other smaller game developers seem problematic, it's annoying. Better avoid them.
A good example would be this >>10602
, like yeah, Erica is a trans woman (and is pretty well portrayed from what I've seen, especially when you compare her to the trans gamers who hate her so much), but it's never said or implied that what happens to her is her fault and that she deserves it. It's a literal demon who doesn't give a shit about humans who gives her the nightmares, just like in most Megami Tensei games. They really don't give a shit about context, and they NEVER give a shit about the disclaimer that whatever company's views aren't portrayed in their games or stories.
Anyway, I'd be surprised if Rin is even a human being in the first place but that's another story.
Why do trans gamers hate Erica at all?
I know they prefer to masturbate over negative portrayal of trans people to get victim sympathy but you'd think that they'd be happy to have a trans character that just exists. Erica just plays a role in the story and just happens
to be trans. Her gender issues and ~journey~ never eclipse the whole story and she doesn't open her mouth to spout teehee strawman opinions.
Most transgamers are gamer gators anyway who hate every part of diversity that isn't trans and caters completely to them. You'd think that what they wanted in some extreme misguided women-hating fashion, and what we wanted, was to have LGBT characters and women in games who don't turn everything into a hamfisted morality play.
What's there to hate here?
How are they western interpretations anon?
Do you have Japanese friends raised in Japan who were transgender and gave you the insiders perspective that this was wrong?
Are you just trying to look for reasons that fit your world view that all trannies are the same and bad no matter which country you visit?
I look at articles, watch videos and try to take an educated guess from the general mentality.
The approach to transgender people in Japan seems pretty right leaning. They insist on keeping biological differences as something immutable. Which is correct.
Then they just give people who are biologically male or female but desire to present as the opposite, the medically recognized go ahead by many doctors to have the necessities they need to live the way they'd like.>“I reject the notion of self-selection of gender,” said Ran Yamamoto, head of the organization gid.jp, which claims around 1,500 members, making it the largest organization of its kind in Japan. (Yamamoto rejects the term "transgender" and considers herself a “woman with GID.”)
It's foreigners who are pushing for this "I can be whatever I want to be and no one can question it, otherwise it's an attack on my own person" mentality.
Honestly I'm not sure at all. I think it's a bit because they're biased towards Atlus and think it's problematic without knowing much about the company in the first place so they hate not only her but other characters as well without even playing any of Atlus game.
I noticed the ones who complain the most about Erica are autogynephiles, don't pass, have nerdy hobbies but spend more time shitting all over video games and anime than liking them, etc. They think that the fact that Erica actually passes as a woman and not a deranged person like them, and the fact that her existence in the game is meant to make the players think she's behind the nightmares pisses them off because they want every trans characters to exist only for realistic representation and virtue-signaling regardless of the setting. I don't know how to explain it very well.
I follow a bunch of fashion models on Instagram, some of which are transwomen. They don’t appear to be the hyper aggressive stereotype that people talk about here, and seem like they just want to live their lives as girls and not really bring up their past. I’ve met a couple in person who were also decent people.
I think it’s sad seeing hundreds of thousands of people thrown under the same bus because some people encountered a few crazies. I have no issue with trans people so long as they shut up about it and act normal, which some of them are capable of doing in my experience.
That being said, I hate dealing with them on imageboards because you’re most likely going to get an autistic robot with no self awareness posting, just like any chan poster with a dick. I used to hang out on /lgbt/ and they were insufferable, most being crossposters from /r9k/ who whined about male opression, female privilege, and wanting periods. Disgusting.
But anyway, I wouldn’t base my opinion of trannies as a whole around those people just like I don’t base my opinion of men around /r9k/.
we're talking about middle class trannies who effect the bulk of society's every day lives. also people know #notalltrannies, but the fact that some are fine doesn't change the fact that the ones who aren't are the ones yelling and changing laws. if your pic is a tranny, they'd have no issue with just going into the womans bathroom without being judged. so they're not lobbying for it.
Is having a role models really that common and influential? Because people seem to be fixated on it. I never wanted to become like a specific person, never copied nobody. I just wanted their fame and wealth. Instead of>i wanna be like that celeb when I grow up
I was more like:>I wanna be famous and live a rich life
>who whined about male opression, female privilege, and wanting periods.
That’s Andreja Pejić, formerly Andrej Pejić.
it's a fact, actually
I don't know why you posted this but there's nothing beautiful in this. I'm glad this person can pass well and seems to be happy but seeing the transformation from cute looking boy into the illusion of something he will never truly really be, biologically, socially (since he was raised as male), etc. To me this was sad, just like watching something beautiful turn into a lie. Trans people need proper treatment, not "transition"
this, i hope we stop this mess…
It was the music what made the vid. I didn't know that it will get filtered.
I don't hate trannies or even dislike them, in fact, some of them are lovely people, but I do not consider them women.
Same for me, but I really hate trans activists, they're just a bunch of self-centered misogynists in denial.
So out of curiosity…do you tell them that you don't see them as women to their face or just when they're not around? Like would you use their preferred pronouns when around them to avoid offending them or straight up call them men?
I'm the same way although it depends on the transwoman. Like I could consider someone like Blaire White or Andreja Pejic to be women, but not creepy crossdressers like Riley Dennis or most transbians for that matter who get pissed at lesbians for not wanting their dick. I wouldn't even mind gynephilic trannies if it weren't for the fact that most of them harass lesbians and if for once they'd bother each other instead of biological women. But most of them won't because that'd be ~transphobic~ to allow women to reject them.
Nta but I'm bored and I think the same way, so I'm going to respond.
I definitely wouldn't say it to their faces because I'm non confrontational and in general I hate to hurt people's feelings. But I do not consider them women even if they look
like the model mentioned, aka if they pass. As soon as I found out the person was male I'd put them in the trans category. Not that something like that is really important: we don't see people in our daily lives as cis male, cis female, and trans, do we?
They didn't grow up as women, so they weren't socialized as women, if now they do try to live as such, not to mention obvious bio differences. I wouldn't be able to lie to myself saying they're women like me or my sister, but I can see them as trans: something in between.
I guess my only issue is that a lot of them really just focus on trying to pass. Which is understandable, since the physical stuff is what we all see and judge first. But I wish there was more of an effort to understand female/male behavior differences and checking themselves when they start acting behavior-ly male.
idk if it's just me but I think there are a lot of differences in the way that the average woman carries herself that's noticeably different from the way the average man does. But I don't think a lot of transgendered people really care about all that stuff, since the root of the issue is body dysmorphia (right? I'm not too sure tbh).
I mean, what does it mean to be a woman anyway? A lot of us just feel fine being women/having female bodies and just go with it, and many of us struggle and try to reconcile being women/being comfortable with our bodies, and our personalities.
they're not hurting me, so i don't care.
seeing some of them claim people are transphobic when they say they don't want to date trans people is annoying though, lol.
i'm saddened by the "business of trans" because i feel like these people who are suffering are being taken advantage of, and i'm disgusted that it's being done to kids. i also really hate the fact that the trans narrative and trans diag criteria seems to rely on 50s gender roles, they are actively dismantling the ideas many of us fought for.https://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2017/12/13/watch-here-the-transgender-kids-documentary-banned-tonight-from-the-cbc/
anyone interested in 'trans' kids please watch this. very terrifying stuff.
>i knew my 4 year old boy was a girl cause he wanted to play with sparkly pink stuff, so we blocked his hormones!
fucked up and sick.
>>11653>i knew my 4 year old boy was a girl cause he wanted to play with sparkly pink stuff, so we blocked his hormones!
I thought you were exaggerating, but yeah, that pretty much happens within the first 5 minutes. >He liked sparkles and pink and did flamboyant things with his hands
This nine year old pretty much "identifies" as a girl because "I don't like the games, clothes, or hairstyles of being a boy"
this kid also says "I'm not comfortable in being in a boy body"
does this really hold weight to prepubescent children?
Interestingly enough, the large majority of children who voice concerns about wanting to be the opposite gender are more likely to be lesbian or gay.
Only 20% of those children will end up insisting they are trans and it is letting those gay and lesbian kids experience normal puberty that they understand they are like that.
If we transition all children on the assumption that they are trans when they talk like this, it could be opening the floodgate for conversion therapy of gay kids to force becoming transgender when they simply are not or we are unable to tell at this stage.
Even good gender doctors often say we have no way of telling which children will give it up and reconcile with being gay or which are trans.
Self esteem and the appearance of their bodies that are not deformed are on the line. So it's very important to get the message out to not jump on the bandwagon.
The sad part is, every human starts out as female until men develop male characteristics. This is why there's little difference between little girls and boys.
Testosterone is no joke of a hormone.
Yeah, for that kid and his mom it was really apparent he might turn out to be a flaming gay, and the mom didn't seem too comfortable with that.
The doc was super interesting, I'd recommend. Thanks anon for linking it!
What the fuck is happening at LC? I made one innocuous comment stating that the transgender movement isn't really on normal people's minds as much as theirs and woke up to half a dozen comments calling me a tranny and an incel. I don't remember the board being that batshit the last time I participated in any transgender discussion, which was probably a good six months ago or so. The discourse back then was relatively much more relaxed than now. What the fuck happened during this time?
For the record I'm not very fond of trannies myself. I've let out some steam in particular regarding the whole bathroom controversy before in the very first (caitlyn jenner as the OP image) thread and since have moved on. How can this shit occupy their attention for years on end? I just don't understand.
I wasn't involved in the discussion there but your post made me curious and i went check. I think what made people mad is the comment you linked and highlighted, and the way you worded it. I don't really like labels to identify myself but I guess many would consider me a ~*~terf~*~ and I'd have grown suspicious too even though your comment alone was pretty harmless. >trannies aren't real>you respond: I don't agree
You made things clearer in your post here by saying you are not very fond of trannies, etc. But there you let that bit out of your post, and maybe people thought you were suggesting you think trannies are women too.
And yeah, I do agree with you it's not something that's always in normal people's minds. It's not even in mine, I only think about it when asked what I think and I'd never be rude to trannies for no reason. I think LC has grown angrier regarding this particular issue because many women there have experienced bad situations IRL involving trannies. I can't remember any particular posts rn but since you said you have been around in previous threads I think you may remember these too.
That is really stupid. It's not my fault they're projecting all sorts of weird shit onto me simply because I said something that they weren't happy to hear.
My friend, you are complaining about getting hate on lc. For real, stop for a second and think what you're complaining about… Getting hate on lc? The whole place is filled with rage and laughter. It was just a comment that got a bit out of context and people got upset. It's not a big deal.
It is what it is and tbqh I'm happy there's at least a few places where women can say what they think about this issue without being thrown in the fire and getting hurt and silenced. I do think they are way too aggressive sometimes but there are few places online where you can say what they do without getting death threats from some tranny that hates "cis women"
I'm not complaining about simply "getting hate" on LC. I'm complaining about their knee-jerk reactions towards any unwelcome opinions them becoming more and more akin to /pol/ and /r9k/, namely how they launch a barrage of insults to shut down discourse. Just swap out "libtard" for "tranny" or "incel". The board hasn't always been like this, not 2 years ago.
>>11692>>trannies aren't real>>you respond: I don't agree>You made things clearer in your post here by saying you are not very fond of trannies, etc. But there you let that bit out of your post, and maybe people thought you were suggesting you think trannies are women too.
Not sure which post you're referring to, but I'm certain I never said anything like this. My post on LC was talking about normal people, not trannies. Which makes the entire thing even more ridiculous.
The best solution is just hide the thread tbh
Honestly, lolcow /b/ (/ot/) has been pretty right-wing since day 1. I've made an effort to avoid all the political threads there. They've never been much better than /pol/.
You're STILL missing my point. I'm talking about their behavior, not their viewpoints.
>>11701>a bunch of feminists>right-wing >>11691
I'm the anon who asked if you were the same tranny as before etc and honestly, your post just came off as "you're all crazy and obsessed about this, NORMAL PEOPLE don't really care you spergy terfs". It was really tone-deaf. I don't agree with all the "hi incel" stuff either, but what the fuck were you expecting? People who've had bad experiences with trannies and are finally able to talk about it without being silenced/threatened to say "oh shucks, you're right"?
>>11712>your post just came off as "you're all crazy and obsessed about this, NORMAL PEOPLE don't really care you spergy terfs"
And you think you aren't exactly that? It's not exactly a one-off thread where some people let off some steam regarding dumb tranny bullshit they've come across; you guys had multiple threads and ongoing generals purposely seeking out and dissecting every facet of the tranny bs, without pause, for a good part of 2017. "People who've had bad experiences with trannies and are finally able to talk about it without being silenced/threatened"? Your narrative's a joke. I'm honestly bewildered all of your attention spans. Having your mind occupied by such drivel 24/7 is the perfect example of crazy and obsessed.
>but what the fuck were you expecting? People who've had bad experiences with trannies and are finally able to talk about it without being silenced/threatened to say "oh shucks, you're right"?
I expected somewhat level headed discourse or at least a genuine attempt to engage with what was being said instead of instant dismissals and name-calling. I got more or less that from the LC's initial threads on transgender, believe it or not. Guess I've been away from that place for too long. Didn't realize it turned into such a shithole.
Also I'm aware of your bs "bad experiences", which amounts to "I saw some tranny tweeting "FUCK TERFs" damned trannies should just die". You're literally the same as /r9k/ and /pol/ going on tumblr just to find some crazy fat acceptance rambling to get mad at. And ALSO just like those two boards, you armchair theorize and attack people who question your baseless theories. I don't like trannies either but you cunts get none of my sympathy. Grow up and grow a pair. Get your fat ass off the computer for once and go outside and realize what it's like too not feel so miserable all the time.
Christ, I feel like I'm just as angry as you guys right now. But I know that at least I possess the capacity to move on. Peace.
>>11715>you armchair theorize and attack people who question your baseless theories
Hope you realize the irony in this statement
I'm not armchairing. I'm going by what I've read in that thread.
You're armchairing me because I assumed you were the same anon as earlier in that thread and lumping me with the people who called you an incel. I was literally just telling you why you got those responses.
Anonymous Moderator 11764
Stop the infighting
i definitely don't consider them female, and if woman is used as a synonym for female i don't consider them women either, and i don't think they should be allowed in female only spaces. however, the misogynist autogynophile trans brigade doesn't represent all trans women at all, so for the ones who are just chill and minding their own business, i don't mind using feminine pronouns and preferred names for them. despite having what might be considered a terf philosophy, i'm friends irl with some transwomen, and if they ever straight up asked me exactly what i think of all this i would be honest, but lo and behold, no one has ever asked me because they're not the kind of trans women who go out of their way to start shit.
if you don't encroach on my business and tell me that i'm privileged for being female or that i must identify with my body because i'm not trans, then i won't encroach on your business and tell you why i don't think you're really a woman.
at the end of the day, if we're both being civil and you're not trying to coerce me or compromise my rights, it's just a semantic/philosophical/political incompatibility on what a woman is, and i have those types of compatibilities with most people. as with any sensitive controversial personal issue, i'll tell you what i think if you show me that you're interested in hearing about it or you have misconceptions about me that i want to correct, but if not, i'll keep it to myself as i don't actually want to upset people if they're just trying to live their lives.
i have those types of *incompatibilities with most people durhhrhrh
>go to lesbian event
>first person I see is a man in a dress
>"yeah men are always trying to invade lesbian spaces"
>Do they consider them women?
No even if they "look" like women. I don't really consider ftm who are more convincing as men either, but I would always use their preferred pronouns anyway. There's no need to be rude. They're men who want to be women and get hormones and surgeries to achieve that but can be women because being a woman depends on a combo of chromosomes, upbringing, experiences and biology, not on just looking and ~feeling~ like one (whatever feeling like a girl means in their heads. Liking dresses and heels and make up and hating boy stuff doesn't really scream woman to me but ok).
>Should they be allowed access to women only spaces (after passing, before passing?)
Tricky question. I think that after they look passable enough it should be acceptable because they could be bullied in the men's bathroom or something but still… I'm unsure (read final answer)
>do you have any experiences good or bad online or offline with transgendered women?
Bad, and 2 times when I was in a public bathroom. Maybe these individuals were just obnoxious and this has nothing to do with being trans but this made me wary of them.
Typo: but cannot* be women because
they're not women, and transsexualism is a harmful practice. my only experiences with them are greasy looking men in wigs + expensive clothing on public transport and angsty girls on my campus that insist "WE NEED TO PROTECT OUR TRANS SISTERS!!"
I mean as long as they don't still look like a big greasy man with a wig and a dress on ig it's okay they aren't women biologically ofc and i don't think a guy playing dress up should be let into women's spaces
if they genuinely look female and have a female voice than whatever idc
i mostly consider them to be girls as long as they have gender dysphoria and as long as they try to look/act female as much as they can. i obviously still can't relate to them nearly as much as i can with cis girls but yes
I always think its funny people say stuff like
>the only transwomen I've seen are ugly giant men in dresses!
like yeah obviously, you don't see the ones that look like girls cause they look like girls lol
None ever look like women, that’s an utter lie. Even those who shoop themselves to hell and back have obviously male features and mannerisms. Men being piss poor emulations of their mysoginistic ideas of what a woman is are not women, how has the world gotten to the point that everyone is willing to cater to the delusions of these men
I don’t consider them women, just men coping with mental illness. I don’t hate the mentally ill. I can sympathize with the dysphoric, non-fetishistic ones as long as they’re not obnoxious and don’t parrot the “transwimmenz are wimmin!” type of rhetoric.
Like dood, stay away from female toilet, like why you even try to enter, ha-ha, you're just a man in a wig.
>>30335>Men being piss poor emulations of their mysoginistic ideas of what a woman is are not women
This is such a dumb meme, TERFs yeah I said it!
are exactly the kind of feminists who, rightly, point out all the dumb and harmful behaviors men engage in but then get all annoyed if a tranwoman acts differently post-transition, but then if the transwoman is one of the really retarded ones who just sticks a dress on and doesn't even bother shaving they're still annoyed. This condundrum is why TERFs twice now, what u gonna do bout it?
end up relying on calling trannies "dangerous" or claiming that if you don't have a functioning womb you can't be a woman, like anyone gets gendered by the outside world because of their internal organs.
If I sound mean, I'm not, I'm just typing fast.
You do realise that it’s our internal organs and hormonal balance that make our outside bodies look different dependent on sex, right? The outside world absolutely can tell apart the sexes. I don’t understand why so many of you are welcoming men into our spaces with open arms when they’ve erased us from so many things already, and many of the sufferings women go through are entirely female specific. It is absolutely a mysoginistic emulation if all they think being a woman is is growing out their hair, throwing on a dress, and either acting like sitcom character/teenage anime girl/or a literal sex object. These men don’t belong to our spaces and we shouldn’t indulge in them, anyone who says that a troon actually looks like a woman is obviously lying just like when people shower hideous people with compliments with how beautiful they are. All these men are so privileged that they can decide that they’re a woman one day and everyone will bend over backwards to accommodate them. Emperors new clothes is the current reality.
They're not women.
Even after transitioning they're not women.
They shouldn't be let into female only spaces, ever.
>>30340>implying anyone here will feel insulted over being called a TERF
a lot of users here are proud radfems, terfs, gencrit, what have you. you must be new.
>>30341>All these men are so privileged that they can decide that they’re a woman one day and everyone will bend over backwards to accommodate them
Trannies get murdered often around where I live, I wouldn't call that privileged. Also to say none of them look female is just straight wrong, check out youtube some time, I remember some young ones were being posted on 4chan a while ago and you would never in a slight chance be able to tell that they have a dick. I say if they look exactly like a woman then they can do woman stuff, everyone will treat them like a woman anyway without thinking, and whatever happens in their bedroom with their genitals with their partner is their own business.
I think if there whould be a possible way to jump into female clonned body, world whould became immidiatly at least 80% female.
And most of men will do just to go in female-only places.
no matter how much a tranny mutilates themselves and pumps themselves full of hormones, they will always be male. they will never have a vagina, only a smelly mutilated penis and underformed breasts, the voice of a chain smoking 60 year old woman taking testosterone pills as well as a painfully male bone and muscle structure. even the best passing ones.
the idea that trannies are indistinguishable from women is a meme. there are only about 10 trannies in the entire world who are able to pass fully as a woman irl, and all of them have had heavy plastic surgery. the ones posted on youtube and 4chan are heavily photoshopped and edited, they look like balding autogynophile rats irl.
can terfs fuck off lol
all chans share the same userbase, crystal cafey is just /po/, but with women instead men and misandry instead misogyny
>>30365>crystal cafey is just /po/, but with women instead men>crystal cafey is just /r9k/, but with women instead men
No, it's not. Can you guys fuck off?
why do you have an issue with it? hide the thread and move on
transgenderism is a mental illness, and it should be treated like one with meds and/or talk therapy. learning to love yourself is something everyone has to deal with, and its the biggest feel good phrase lefties throw out now but when it comes to trannies it's just "YASS CUT THOSE TITS OFF! CASTRATE YOURSELF QUEEN"
its insane. loving yourself means coming to terms with the things you dont like too. trannies need to come to terms with their illness and accept their body as it is. no one chooses what theyre born as, no one's 100% happy in their skin. race, gender, genetics, its all a dice roll that you learn to live with.
Even if all women ever kept quiet about their knowledge of basic biological differences between the sexes, men still wouldn't be able to turn into women.
i agree, they should get mental help instead of this bullshit. imagine if people started demanding that anorexics should get free liposuction because its who they are on the inside uwu. its insane.
its actually disturbing how some studies report that people actually have higher suicide rates after srs than before.
i will allow the hot trannies into my female space, but the ugly ones are subhuman and don't belong anywhere
and none of them are true females in my eyes
99,99% of trannies don't pass by any standarts without heavy make-up, lots of plastic sutgeries or huge photoshops skills in real life. "Hot trannies" exist only in anime.
Mental illness like any other and should be treated as such.
I have to bite my tongue a lot because I try to treat people with kindness and respect, but I keep having the same thought:
It's not that you don't "pass". It's not "transphobia" or "transmisogyny". It's that you're ugly.
It's really that simple, most of the time.
Ugly trans women seem to think that if they pass, they're supposed to get treated like 10/10 staceys - and if they don't, they assume it's because they're trans. In reality, being bullied, disrespected, and excluded from things is just how ugly women live their lives.
I'm friends with a few normal trans women, and some normal trans men, irl - I'm a lesbian, myself. I've seen plenty of fat, ugly, or just generally horrible lesbians claim that the reason they're social outcasts is because they're gay. It's not homophobia, it's that they're ugly.
Same with hideous straight women who blame misogyny.
This. All those “hot” trannies you see in pics don’t actually look like that irl.
Be honest, do you hate ugly people?
i dont mind them and i consider them to be women, but I dont really want them here on crystal cafe because they are already widely accepted on 4chan and /lgbt/
kek, pretty true though, ugly women get the short stick on life. i think that has a lot to do with mysogyny too though as other women dont really care and will treat ugly women the the same as anyone, while men flat out ignore, avoid, or berate them as if their very existence is an insult.
even incels and trannies only really recognize pretty women as "real women"(this is largely why i dont give a shit about tranny feefees anymore).
anyone under 5/10 is literally invisible in society. being an ugly woman is truly suffering.
What they said.
They will never be women, they are mental ill men. I don't want them near me or in female spaces.
A therapy that has such a big failing chance is no therapy. Mutilating a healthy body should be forbidden Yes I am against beauty surgery
! Men and women are different, they need different medication doses and react different. You don't feel like a women, you don't wake up and be like "Damn today I only feel like 20% women." You are a women.
Many people hate what they are and what they will become.
Hell I wanted to become a dragon (no not furry like a real one) when I was a child I hated being a human.
When I got into puberty and got my first period with 9 years
I cried for months because I was so afraid. I prayed every night to whoever was up there, that I don't want to grow up. I did not want to be an adult nor a woman. So I dressed as unfeminine as I could and acted masculine. Now with nearly 30 I started to accept my body. I still have problems and it is still a long road ahead of me.
If someone had told me in this time, that EVERYTHING would be better if I would become a guy and that I could become 100% a boy I would have done it in a heartbeat.
But I would, 20 years later, be so unhappy that I would pretty sure kill myself. If you go on reddit it is nearly a cult: "join us you will feel better. Stop listening to you parents, they don't know. Believe us. If they don't help you they hate you." Everything against "this cult" is shut down immediately.
That is why I am so against that.
It is not healthy. It does not help it just creates problems. It does only 'help' for a 'short time'. It does not get rid of the real problem.
Sorry if i made mistakes with the writing and stuff, but i needed that off my chest.
Late reply but no, I consider myself pro-ugly women. A few of my best and oldest friends are hideous fat autists and it doesn't detract from our friendship. If anything, I'm grateful to have ugly friends.
When I pick up annoying male orbiters, for example, I like to make it clear that they're beneath my friends, status-wise. It's fun watching them desperately try to keep pretending they respect women/aren't trying to get in my pants. Since I'm a lesbian and all.
If a trans girl is on HRT, she develops those "girl" pheromones and her skin softens. I didn't really understand it until I made friends with one right before she started transitioning, and at some point my gut reaction to her BO went from "that's a man" to "i'd fuck that". So that experience decided my perspective on these things.
>>31673>I consider myself pro-ugly women. A few of my best and oldest friends are hideous fat autists and it doesn't detract from our friendship. If anything, I'm grateful to have ugly friends.
not the person you're talking to, but it's so strange to me that some people care if their friends are attractive or not. Even my sister told me that she doesn't want ugly friends. And I've always noticed pretty girls seem to hang together. From my life experiences and the way strangers treat/complement me, I'm most likely reasonably attractive. But I have a lot of geeky hobbies and have the sweetest, funniest, but I guess "ugly" friends. My family makes fun of me for it all the time. Acquaintances have made comments.
Anyone else notice this phenomenon? It's ridiculous. I'm not trying to fuck my friends why do I care?
What really disturbs me about those reddit spaces is that being trans is SO fetishized. Tons of men admitting they just want to be a ditsy blonde or that wearing panties gives them a boner. And they all seem to watch sissy porn!! And don't get me started about how they all identify as subservient anime girls on reddit. I really hope that it isn't actually just a fetish for them and they aren't ruining their lives.
I used to have a "friend" who said she hates unattractive people and that they "tear down the entire group's appearance" but what do you know, she had an extremely inflated sense of self to cope with being really damn insecure, and she wasn't very attractive either. She looked good from some angles but had a really prominent nose that she hated, a witchy chin, scarred mouth and looked 10 years older than she was. So she had this extreme obsession with looking good and never left the house without a full face of makeup because she needed to lift herself up.
I get it now, you only keep them around you for your own self esteem.
Ackshually, women who keep ugly friends are less
likely to be narcissistic than women whose friends are all physically attractive, and women who maintain friendships with women of lower social status are less
likely to be social (ab)users than women whose friends are all more or less on their same level.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22947669
There is a persistent myth of a "queen bee" personality who makes sure that all of her friends are socially dependent on but visibly inferior to herself. Some examples might be found across the internet, but those seem like very isolated cases. My real life experience is that the girl who makes friends with ugly girls is actually genuinely nice, and the queen bee slander is usually slung by genuinely mean people, consistent with that study.
t. genuinely mean person with no ugly friends
Beautiful people get slandered way too much
Beauty correlates with diligence, intelligence, and wealth. Put another way, beauty manifests where someone has the motivation, social awareness, and means to create it. As much as we as a society love the "bitchy, spoiled high school beautyqueen who deserves nothing" - in reality she probably worked for it. And on the flipside the "peasant beauty with a heart of gold" a classic in fairy tales, they'd never be able to afford the lifestyle to take care of yourself enough to look attractive.
Idk anon, I've known some shitty pretty people. Like hot girls at my old workplace who gossiped and created drama. Same with some trashy drug abusing hot guys I've known. I don't assume all beautiful people to be nasty though, of course they're diverse.
On the flip side, ugly people are almost always degenerate in some way due to ostracization. With beautiful people I think the constant good treatment either makes them lazy OR inspires them. But uglies? Usually kind of weird.
t. Uggo for life because I refuse to get ps
(Talking mainly about facial aesthetics btw, although those girls I mentioned also watched their weight and everything the face is the real base here)
You're right, face is the place
Even if guys won't openly admit it I would say a good face is more important than probably anything to getting a bf. (like an actual relationship not just tinder fucks)
Why are trannies always so fucking tall? They always seem to be taller than the average man, and then they wear heels and suddenly they'e 6'5. I've only spotted a few average sized men and rarely any short trannies, but maybe that's b/c they don't stand out as much and just look like ugly women.
I view them like furries, in that it's safe to assume they're borderline, bipolar, or autistic until proven otherwise. With that said, every mtf I've met has been a furry.
the normal sized (like 5'9 and under) trannies pass better, that's why you don't notice them.
Most mtf trannies don't pass well, but the ones who put the money/skills into looking like a whole women just look like tall, square-faced, chestlets with annoying voices. There've been trannies l've met at gay bars (mostly ftm) that I didn't know were trans until they told me.
I really shouldn't reply to this horrific bait thread but I have strong opinions on this topic.
No, I don't like trans people at all. I used to be pretty okay with them and have an open mind and was friends online with a fair few of them. If they act like a normal person, I don't have a problem with them and hope they can be happy.
Spoiler for lengthy anecdote but after my ex-boyfriend, after 5 years of being a very supportive and model boyfriend to me, started changing his name on various online services and said to me "I'm non-binary" I was like okaaaay… but then they quickly deteriorated into the obnoxious cult-like trans stereotype and trying to show me extremely unfunny memes from reddit. It was plainly obvious he was being influenced by our other friends and wanted to fit in as he had never mentioned anything of the sort to me before, his workplace also being an inclusive type and encouraging it. Even went behind my back to take hormones and change his legal name by deed poll which really pissed me off, even more because his excuse was "you're not very receptive when I talk about it" I wonder why, m8. It put a real strain on the relationship for nearly a year because I hadn't had a boyfriend before him and didn't want to face the possibility of being single again since I have my own problems with loneliness. I never even used his preferred name out of wanting to be spiteful and not give him the satisfaction. Eventually he ended up fucking off and cheating with a friend of ours (who is also male, making him gay as well because of course) just because said other person was more accepting of these delusions causing us to drift apart, which pissed me off even further and I broke up with him shortly after finding a new boyfriend who I'm much happier with. It's such a shame because before all of this happened, I was really happy with him and he gave my sheltered ass a lot of new experiences, even visiting Japan which was my dream for a long time, and I thought I was finally going to get to move out and marry him, ahahahahaha…
I guess I'm just glad I was born female and I'm happy with it, I get to be smug that I have what trannies wish they had and will never have. Also as a result I've realised that my political beliefs are rather right wing and traditionalist, I only want a heterosexual monogamous relationship with traditional gender roles and there's nothing wrong with that.
I was pretty tomboyish growing up and have mostly male-orientated interests, but I also have female-orientated interests (the most recent being wanting to pursue lolita fashion and being a proper Victorian-era lady). Never have I thought I have to be trans male just because of said male-orientated interests, I just am who I am and again, there's nothing wrong with that. I enjoy the attention of being a female in a male-orientated space. I also don't like how they're now associating autism with it and making people think there's a high correlation, since I'm high functioning autistic myself and it rubs me the wrong way.
I think the thing I hate the most about just really LGBT types in general, is how they come into the communities and companies for specific interests and try to take it over, making everything about themselves and how trans and gay they are in the name of DIVERSITY and INCLUSION. It's just obnoxious and pretentious and it makes me feel undermined and patronised because I don't agree with their agenda.
Wew I sure ranted a lot.
see i think that's my main problem with trans people.
you can do what you want. wear a dress if you want but nothing will make you a women but why does it matter that much? a lot of times it feels like people "feel" like their the other because they associate things and actions with a gender and think to themselves " i must be such and such"
also body/gender dysphoria is a mental illness just like depression is but we aren't letting every depressed person medically end their lives. we try to help them understand their personal issues and hopefully help them heal and cope in healthier ways and this is coming from a clinically depressed person.
idk maybe thats close minded of me but it feels like a non-issue if we all accept that you can have a penis or a vagina while doing everything just fine. wanna be a woman and become a beef cake? wanna be a guy and do whatever people assume is feminine then do it.
the whole thing seems odd to me.
>>31748>also body/gender dysphoria is a mental illness just like depression is but we aren't letting every depressed person medically end their lives
lol I've been waiting to hear that argument.
mY dYsPhOrIa MeAnS iNsUrAnCe NeEdS tO pAy FoR mY eStRogEn
If that was true, I'd need emergency lipo paid by my insurance to cure my body dysmorphia
Little bit late but, I know right??!!
It is so weird and disturbing to read, like they hope to transform into a small girl or sissy.
They never want to be women or god forbid a black women. They always want to be slutty little perfect anime girls. It creeps me the hell out.
Some entrys even gave me skin crawler feelings.
They still hate women, but want to be them so bad, it is so weird.
>>31768>They never want to be women or god forbid a black women.
That reminds me of this. They're not only delusional, they become entitled and let their racism, sexism, and other prejudices slip when the world refuses to pander to their delusions.
I've seen way too many things like pic related, and trans-women calling natal women "cunts", "bitches", "whores", etc who should "know our place". It's funny that these are some of the same people who want to yell at natal women for perpetrating "cis white feminism" (thanks Andi Dier and all of Twitter), even though they themselves are often some of the most fucked up, backward people on earth.
I used to support transwomen because I thought they were a hugely oppressed group, but they're only really oppressed in the sense that they are mentally ill people upset that not everyone is validating them in their illness.
I don't get why when men push their delusions on people, it's treated as valid, but when women do it, it's treated as mental illness (which it is).
By trans logic, if I'm attractive, but feel ugly in my mind because I'm not a very specific image, that means I'm right, I am ugly. It's not sick or unhealthy to "correct" my body by starving the fuck out of it, taking carcinogenic pills to change myself, and hacking my body up with all sorts of surgeries. It's therapy, and the only right way to go about things. If my parents don't support this, and even pay for my "treatments" if I ask them to when I'm still a child, they are effectively abusing me. In fact, in a fair world, the government should be paying for all my procedures, anyone who says I was beautiful before is prejudiced and ignorant, and I should never stop.
Anyone sane would agree that this is insane, self-absorbed and it can't be healthy, but when some porn addicted man who thinks life as a woman is like all the hentai and sissy/bimbo porn he's rotted his brain with, or a guy who flat-out feels ugly and "wrong" in his own skin says it, we should all listen and "open our minds"? We all need to swallow the concept that it's a "woman trapped in a man's body" or else we're committing violence? It just doesn't make sense.
Trannies are just coping sissy incels. Call them that and epin bants will ensue.
I was playing a online game (I don't use my voice for obvious reasons) and suddenly this person with a feminine username and profile pic started bringing attention to themselves in the most obnoxious ways; they started "uwu flirting" in /all chat and after being ignored started saying stuff like "Who wants feet pics" and trolling and the like; later they casually mentioned their twitter profile (again after being largely ignored whole game). Once that short match was over I checked their twitter profile they mentioned all while thinking "maybe it was just a incel trying to be like those gamer-grill caricatures in a mocking way" but behold it was a MtF. Filled with the standard vents and sad-posts you see on any trans twitter that made it seem genuine.
I know very few trans IRL, but they largely keep to themselves. Online brings the crazy in all people but I just find it plain absurd and sometimes offensive the lengths these people go to try and get any form of attention and validation along with what their conceived notions of femininity are. Makes you wonder why they are so prevalent in fetish communities online.
I really want to empathize with MtFs. I really do. However, I believe a decent amount of them are self-hating men with a sissyfication fetish.
Unlike most miners, I think if a trans woman were to pass and perform womanhood in a genuine and respectful manner, they are women and should be treated as such as far as society is concerned. If I can look at and interact with a tranny and my mind says "she's a woman", I'm not gonna call them a he because I find out they're trans. My issue is the incels in dresses who are only turn into transwomen because they've failed as men.
I agree with this. I have friends irl who are trans (in either direction) and they're usually pretty good people who are nothing like the wild fetish incels and despise those too. They usually have other mental problems too (bpd and depression usually) but are otherwise enjoyable and rational. They all do their best to pass and don't make a fuss if they get misgendered, some get a bit sad but they all know they can't avoid it despite being in a hyper-liberal country. I used to be extremely supportive of trans people until the recent surge of fetishizing sissy incels, so now whenever I see someone declare themselves a trans woman, I automatically withdraw and fear they're one of these. I went from very liberal to gender-critical within 3 years. Usually the FTMs are way more easygoing and passable though, the worst they do is dress obnoxiously over the top female and bait for misgendering so they can screech, but they at least don't harass and assault others, they just play oppression olympics. Almost all the MTFs I know have autism or aspergers.
>>31780>perform womanhood in a genuine and respectful manner
Most REAL women can't pull this off anymore lmao
Wish I could just take some idiot Stacy's W card because she is an embarrassment to our gender.
Exactly my experience, one anecdote to another, with transgender and nonbinary people.
I know a ftm who keeps to himself, works hard, does all those regular life things, and has no issue with being misgendered. He never had a coming out stating that it was unnecessary and last time I saw him was doing nicely with a girlfriend and career.
I know another "ftm", 28 years old mind you, who threw a fit in public from a bartender misgendering them. Their relationships are a mess of poly triages gone wrong, they're morbidly obese, dress childishly, and have yet to break out as a "freelance artist". They cried for months on tumblr about how their family refusing to throw them a coming out party rivalled racial genocide. Underline that.
The ftm/mtf I know nicely fit into two categories coinciding with the above. The ones in the second are the ones that make me side eye for the hills as for them their gender identity may as well as be an accessory and nothing more.
Could you post some of their art?
FTMs tend to be more like Kevin Garrah. Chill short dudes with boy clits. MTFs are shrill-voiced SJWs at best, Chris-chan tier autists at worst.
Agreed except Kalvin seems to have anger issues (talking about how much he wants to punch people and generally being like a complete middle-of-puberty douche but I guess that's accurate considering what testosterone does to FTMs), so I wouldn't call him chill. He's actually one of the most aggressive FTMs I've seen, the ones I know are a lot more chill and don't take to youtube channels to sperg out about people they don't agree with. MTFs are generally either autistic or overtly sexual and demand to be catered to. It's almost as if people who grow up as women are socialized to be timid and people who grow up as men think they can steamroll everyone into submission.
Sort of ot but how to find a trans bf? Or does it only happen by chance?
I found my level-headed and non-screeching-autist, awesome trans bf through tumblr. The funny thing is I didn't know he was trans until later- he never posts about his personal life. I had suspicions due to him being proactive in sending these really nice asks and messages to followers working through transgender issues, and just being an all around decent guy in the LGBT scene… anyways my tip is to look for that I guess.
lmao at the use of eggman. I guess he is kind of androgynous.
No proof those messages were at the bio when it had that pic though. They could have used an instathot photo originally then swapped it for the first screenshot.
Even so, in certain contexts men will talk shit (flattery) to stick their dick in a pussy but will resent and hate the woman for being imperfect. "Paper bag over head" is a meme and so is "pussy's pussy." That definitely counts as insulting and cruelly deceptive. Hardly a good thing.
In most day to day life (so, not on dating (fucking) apps or in a club/bar), ugly women are ignored and make people uncomfortable like anon said.
t. ex-frumplet and now average
Tinder interest is not real life interest. Most of the dudes messaging are just desperate. Also 9 messages and 37 matches is on the low end of normal if you've ever been on tinder.
I can't even count the amount of times I've heard "god I fucking hate her, but she's hot and I just want to fuck", or "god she's fat/ugly but I just really need to get laid". Women are pickier because they're usually looking for long-term companionship and not pump and dump.
This. Transgender "women" should be treated no differently here than regular men. Any post even remotely indicating than the poster is a born-male should get the same treatment as a regular male. i.e. a hearty ban.>>31693
I have the suspicion a pretty face is everything when it comes to marriage material for men. I once got someone to admit it to me that he couldn't care less about the timeless "boobs vs. butt" dilemma and that someone flat as plank with a cute face trumps a fugly face with hottest body in the planet. It's only one man, but still.
>>31817>I know another "ftm", 28 years old mind you, who threw a fit in public from a bartender misgendering them. Their relationships are a mess of poly triages gone wrong, they're morbidly obese, dress childishly, and have yet to break out as a "freelance artist". They cried for months on tumblr about how their family refusing to throw them a coming out party rivalled racial genocide. Underline that.
Cringed irl. This describes my "nonbinary" ex gf and her social circle to a T. I really dodged a bullet with that one
From the /lgbt/ board on 4chan. It's Amanda Palmer, obviously, but ugly cis women are now definitely being called trannies.
I still use tumblr and have no shame, sometimes I discover things like pic related.
What the fuck…Source? I've got to read more.
I have yet to encounter a single tranny that isn't an absurd cliche of a woman. That "female brain" meme is total bullshit. They don't have female brains, they have male brains that get aroused by turning them self into a sexual deviation idol of what a horny dude thinks is feminine to the extreme or completely fail socially and at life in general and choose to turn into what they think is the key to easy mode existence. They can't get the waifu/gf so they become it.
Still with a all the lgbtquthdmdk-rights and outright demented SJW'ism, pan-poly-daragondildo-dogfart sexuality or "your rights end were my feelings begin" and what else has to be not only tolerated but accepted and celebrated in our timeline, I don't see why people can't demand to be a woman and just turn into one regardless of their biological sex.
Quite hypocritical to suddenly make a cut at guys in dresses and call it degenerate or be uncomfortable with it after all the shit that is okay.
I would be happier with not separating sexes (what a retarded word) that much as we do in the first world most of the time anyway. We get bombarded with FUCK FUCK FUCK GENITALS GENITALS everywhere, people attend in dating TV shows where they sell their naked bodies like meat and it seems strange to me that we still strictly divide those genitals flying around everywhere.
obviously there are some trans people who are clearly just people with more issues than just gender dysphoria, or tools who claim a bogus gender identity for oppression points.
however, most trans women i've met are decent people, with gender dysphoria. the medically accepted treatment for such a problem is transition. i think these sorts have a right to be as they are, unbothered and treated with respect, so long as they're not a creep or a shitheel. those who 'pass'/have fully transitioned ought to be allowed in women's spaces, but more spaces designed specifically for trans women could make this less of an issue.
imo trans women are women, but they are different from cis women. if they were the same, we wouldn't need such a distinction as trans. frankly, judging from some of my discussions, transpolitics is getting so weird that even a lot of trans people are starting to get disillusioned. how strange!
Yeah i agree with you, most trans persons who I've met online are pretty chill but then again there are a few nutjobs out there. I think that everyone with genderdysphoria needs to go to therapy first before trying to transition. Most of the time trans people kill them self anyway after even after they transitioned cuz they still got genderdysphoria and even after transitioning it doesn't go away.
I noticed that gay dudes who are trans are way less creepy and most of the time they understand that woman need personal space and don't want to get into woman lockers ect. Transbians have the most creeps and try to force their dicks on lesbians. Which i don't understand why they do that, there are enough bi woman so why do they go after lesbians so much?
>>37707>imo trans women are women
How? What makes them women? What is your definition of a woman?
>>37729>there are enough bi woman so why do they go after lesbians so much?
validation from women, same reason they hate and talk about terfs so much (which are such a specific minority) versus regular transphobes
I really have no idea what the statistics are now but I remember reading that until the 1970s if not later the standard feminist position was that transsexuals were not women.
Don't think you're so clever, tranny. We can see you're just trying to fit in by selling out the other guys.
Who cares tbfh, if anon knows enough to do that, she passes and shouldn't give a fuck.
Except this person does not, and that's why they were recognized.
Every tranny I met so far and interacted with (all online, my country is pretty conservative still when it comes to these things) has been a mentally ill caricature of a woman. They always cause drama and act like entitled shits. Interestingly enough they're all really wealthy and loaded. I know a couple from this mmo I play and one is a cute uwu discord tranny that loves oppai loli catgirls while the other keeps to herself and generally sounds grounded but is a huge erp pervert that loves elves with humongous tits.
Sometimes I feel like there's something weirdly perverse about trannies like >>37679
said but I don't really give a fuck about "female spaces" I don't care about sharing toilets with men etc. We're all humans, I treat everyone with the same amount of respect respect whether they were a mentally ill tranny or a random Jane/John Doe.
Sadly this all started with third wave feminism, the whole "a woman is not born , is made " thing Beauvoir and the polyamory she kept forcing because muh revolutionize gender roles, muh rethink what gender even is. No wonder she was caught grooming underage students to sleep with her and passed them on to her creep husband. Even signed a petition to remove age of consent laws in France and make pedophilia legal.
These are the ideologues that hurt women a lot. All troonie and tumblr lgbtoararadsd loonacy has a genesis in that stuff.
I personally find then disgusting excuses for human beings. They base their entire identity and persona on their sexual fetish. Yuck.
At a local small cafe I go to from time to time there's this one worker who's a transgender girl.
"She" and I have talked sometimes since I was just curious about what life like that must be like and she seemed pretty lonely.
Essentially she's a complete wreck and the hormones have been destroying her body. Apparently she's constantly at the doctor's office changing dosages despite the fact she's done this for four years.
Despite all that pain and turmoil that she puts herself through, she still honestly looks pathetic. She'll never pass and is almost guaranteed to be another member of the 40% club one of these days.
Why society encourages this instead of getting them the mental help they need I'll never know.
Treating gender dysphoria with hormones is like treating depression with suicide tbqh
And I just got reminded of my first ever conversation with a trans person. First thing she asked me once we got over the basics was what my bust measurement was. When I told her she immediately went into brag mode how hers were bigger and how she has a fetish for huge tits and how one day she wants to have mind boggingly humongous titties. Female brain btw
Or treating homosexuality with marriage. The Rubicon was crossed, now there´s no taking back any of that stuff.
Because psychology is dead.
Talking to people for months or even years, carefully analyzing them and essentially heal their minds with nothing but words and training takes forever, is costly as fuck and may even not provide a full set of hard data to track back the process for optimization since humans are so different and emotions can't be expressed in numbers with absolute certainty.
That makes quality management and controlling for psychology again expensive or even impossible from time to time.
Things that cant be 100% optimized and analyzed in those absolute numbers bear no measurable profit and things that don't do so essentially have no right to exist in the 21 century.
But thankfully, there is the drug abusing older Brother of psychology, its psychiatry and psychiatry is perfectly adapted to post industrial society.
Instead of endlessly talking you just quickly diagnose the illness (like the doctors they are), adjust the right cocktail of brainmelters and tadaaaa functioning human being. Its fast, its (relatively) cheap, it uses medical products to keep the market running AND there is no such thing as failure. If psychology fails, that's it, call the psychiatrists. If psychiatry fails you still can just go the knock out route and deactivate the scrapped ones. That's even faster and cheaper than maintaining them.
I work in a psychiatric ward and its impressive how a good doc can form the personality desired by the customer (seldom the poor fucker who is about to get melted) in around two weeks if the case isn't to severe.
That's not without cost (besides money) obviously. Permanent heavy medication will drastically reduce the lifespan of our products but hey, can't use a car without wearing it down either.
So instead of helping them, they just get the medication treatment since there are no people left who learned how to actually cure the mind.
Problem is that body dysphoria (there is no such thing as gender dysphoria, that's just how its labeled for the masses to make it easier to understand) is a tricky one and prone to failure (suicide or knock out pile if we can get our hands on them in time) because no one really understands whats going on and to make it worse the "treatment" consists of hormones and hormones tend to do illogical strange stuff no one fully grasps either.
Medical treatment of BD is basically just throwing halfway researched shit at the patient and see what happens. Halfway researched in medical terms is bad, like REALLY bad. Just a side advise: NEVER do so if you can't avoid it. I personally would wage dying instead of playing lab rat.
Also further investigation and research is mostly suppressed* because its an ideology that bored suburb soccer moms use to spice up their dead end of a live project.
You cant say rational things because rational things aren't always pleasant and identity movements are designed to fill hollow people with a fake positive personality.
Those people are hollow because they can't build up one of their own and thinking about it would break down the whole construct (like immersion in a movie or game) so the identity "sold" has to be (idolized) as perfect as possible to silence critical thoughts in any way. Its basically following the same model as nationalism or monarchy but purely build with ideas instead of one leader/nation (rather scary shit btw).
*there was this American Tzimisce, a virtuoso in his field, who had about 50% of MtF patients who called him and begged for an reverse surgery with several suicides following because the outcome was so bad and BD is obviously not cured by mauling their genitalia.
He was actually interested in how to make peoples life better so he did research by himself and later tried to get a study founded based on his first findings (namely that majority of transitioned patients got talked into it and that the suicide/drug abuse/self harm rates of patients after and before the surgery stayed the same or even increased).
The university basically told him to back off instantly before something bad happens to him and his career and that they don't want to have anything to do which such an politically loaded topic. Well no research anymore but instead chopped off dicks and suicides so suburb folk and university students with colored hair can circlejerk more.
PS: Sorry for the wall 'o text, I drank about a hundred coffee.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ they’re women, the majority. Obvi ppl like Jessica yaniv are not
>>37865>using the no true scotsman argument to make yourself look good
The majority are agp perverts like Yaniv, not real "women". If you believe otherwise you're either delusional or have been watching too much tranny youtube.
>what are /b/'s thoughts on transgender mtfs? Do they consider them women?
yeah as long as they learn how to stop acting like men
Should they be allowed access to women only spaces (after passing, before passing?)
yes but they should be considerate to the norms of cisgender women i.e sitting to pee in a womens restroom. i've never been creeped on in a bathroom or changing area by a woman, trans or not.
> do you have any experiences good or bad online or offline with transgendered women?
one time at the dmv this trans woman with stubble was making a huge ruckus about how her ID said M instead of F. like i get how hard it is to legally change your gender, and it sucks having your ID not match your photo, but holy shit it's the DMV stop fucking yelling.
online i had it be suggested that i am transgender male or nonbinary because i do not fit the gender role. i found this to be sexist, like reinforcing gender roles, saying i must not be a real female because of how i dress, how i act, what i do, etc. it's on my birth certificate and i'm not fucking changing it. this has only happened once and it was on dumblr of all places so i didn't take it to heart to assume all transgenders are like this in the real world where theres no echochamber.
I honestly wonder if this Yaniv creature is intentionally trying to sabotage the tranny movement. I read about that incident going around closing womens' home salons by demanding a Brazilian then siccing the lawyers on them.
I dunno, it just seems way too insane for a person wanting sympathy to do… but then again, these are unbalanced people.
I dunno, really seems like the overall image of what a trans person is like has shifted completely since literal autists started swarming the label like flies for the last 5 years or so that it has become mainstream. And the USA being the main hub of this "cartoon obsessed pink colored hair communist transbian that goes to college and doesn´t even remotely acts like a real girl" types.
Isn´t the statistic that like a third of transgenders have autism? I feel the more mediatic it became the more of this type of people (autistic, hetero middle class shut in males) saw an opening to validate their weird fetishes and justify their weird obssessions, while traditionally the type that would be considered trans would be very obviusly afeminate gay males that seriously can´t help themselves acting exceedingly female and have been this way since early childhood, like they are so gay and so affeminate they can´t even male.
This weird fetish autists may be doing it because thats why the truly believe but they are still ruining any chance at believability the label could possibly have so they are still saboteours for all practical purposes , even when they are not in on it.
Please, please, please learn the word "effeminate" properly.
english is not my first language. Sorry it upsets your sensibilites so much.
I don't mind hanging around in places with loads of trans women (generally mostly male discords and such) cause I feel a little superior in comparison for being a natural born female. Pathetic maybe, but I don't really care.
Kind of annoying when the 'girltalk' channels in discord servers are 90% pre-everything trans though. You want to talk about actual girl topics and they're all in there talking about moe anime and trains.
That makes total sense though. I'm sure the more girly ones are out shopping or getting coffee or something, not sitting around talking to strangers on the internet.
>>38035>tfw like trains but will be mistaken for a tranny if I talk about them
Hm… what's your favorite locomotive?
>all the transphobia in this thread
y i k e s
I'm not scared of them, they just don't belong in women spaces because they aren't women.
I mean, I'm scared of them in the same way I am random men, being that I don't want to be alone with them in places like Bathrooms where there's only one exit. Anyone that doesn't feel that way is either brainwashed into believing they're not men, or they've never been threatened by a man.
this reminds me of when i was browsing r/actuallesbians and saw a top comment of someone saying "its perfectly fine for a lesbian to like dick uwu that doesn't make her any less of a lesbian" god i hate libfems and sjws
How are they women? What makes them women?
I don't support bullying anyone, but I see no logical, helpful reason to outright deny reality.
>They are women, just like us
Explain how. What is your definition of a woman? Does the word “woman” even have any meaning anymore?
kill yourself, men that cut off their dicks arent women
I'd agree with you if it weren't for my personal experience with many trans "women" that just act like caricatures of women to satisfy their weird fetishes, desires, mental illnesses, repressed feelings, whatever. Not one tranny I had an honest convo with has actually behaved or expressed thoughts in a way an actual woman would. They THINK they're women, but any actual woman is able to see that they're not, they're only trying.
I just don't buy the female brain shit. People can be as degenerate and weird and bizarre as they want, I don't mind it but be honest with yourselves for Gods sake.
Exactly, like a living stereotype.
I have never gotten a gay vibe from gigi gorgeous. i just think he is a very vain male who wanted to be adord. greg is so lazy that he didnt even wait for his boobs to heal. so i doubt that he really takes his hormones properly. he looks more manly as time goes by. i think nats brings out the man in him and they will have a baby the old fashion way.
The only trans women I consider legitimate lived quietly and were indistinguishable from cis women in how they acted and thought.
However the ones most people (and I) know of are the attention-seeking kind using social media as a megaphone and echo chamber for mental illness, and trying to twist that into a gender identity, AND crying victim when they're questioned. It's an unfortunate cycle.
Girls here usually leave their thoughts as well.
horse stuck in hol…
I honestly feel bad for any trans women browsing this board and there definitely are. I have had trans friends who I always have considered the same as me or any other woman.
You should all be ashamed not all them fit your stereotypes
>>40076>any trans women browsing this board
Hey, to any transwomen browsing this board right now, I want you to know that you will never be a woman and that you aren’t welcome here <3
LOOOOOOOOOOLLLLL! Fucking based.
The dichotomy of the general respectful tone here and absolute savagery towards the trans menace on here will never cease to amaze me.
You mean mentally ill men in skirts?
>>40242>You should all be ashamed not all them fit your stereotypes
You mean the stereotype of being a mentally ill man who tries to trick other people into thinking he's a woman? Nah, that's common to all of them.
They shart up every board they touch. Look at 4ch, an already shitty place shitted up even more.
I hope they feel unwelcome and never come back
I thought Crystal was overall a liberal board. Don't understand all the hate.
This is a board for women, and they're men. Shoo.
Yeah, but most of progressive people consider them to be women.
I thought people here could agree.
Unnaturally colored hair, pink clothes and a gaping wound in your crotch are not what make a woman.
They don't become biological women just because other people consider them to be women. I consider you to be a fucking retard, but that doesn't make you an actual sub-80 IQ retard.
I hate m2f even more than i hate males.
Men could be tolerated, as long they don't nagging me (for some reason i attract crybaby males a lot).
But m2f are just males with some fucking serious mental problems.
I got some irl and online interactions, almost all of them said to me that they whold suicide if i ignore then or just start gossip talks behind me.
Same. Not only are they men, but they invade and take over everything that belongs to us and kick us out while at it. I don't understand them, they hate us with a passion. They always preach about replacing biowomen and all that faggotry.>>40540
I’m cool with transwomen and I think they’re valid but I’d say most users here aren’t, or at least don’t want transwomen on bismuth buffet because they pretty much dominate every other imageboard.
Some tranny is pretending to be from cc and obnoxiously spamming 4chan boards. That’s probably why we’ve been getting raided recently.
Its fucking annoying. I saw that theyre coming from some take-hrt-or-get-doxxed discord server.
Ugh i fucking hate these idiots. This is why cc is for REAL women only. This is a perfect example of why trannies shouldnt be trusted.
They’re deranged and make those posts multiple times a day. Always shit like “taking HRT changed my life!!~” with pictures of anime girls that look like 15 year olds. I don’t want cc being associated with that.
Another reason to ban trannies.
Glady I think people on 4chan simply don't care about us.
It's funny how trannies seem to ask for our help all the time even though they still work to destroy women and don't even bother to hide their hate and envy.
Not surprised, troons ruin everything they come across and should never be allowed on here
Lmao imagine being this bitter over girls not wanting to play with you.
I hope the admins not a tranny, heard rumors they were one and use to post user information along with IP addresses on a private discord for troons :/ I hope this isn't true
It was nothing, I tried deleting the post and thought clicking delete would erase it (I’ve been here for a while but never deleted a post before) Mainly cause I didn’t want beef with the admin if this was true.
getting pregnant is gross anon, i dunno why'd you want that…
why do men like posting here so much holy shit
It's also kind of sexist implying if you don't pump out babies you're not a real woman. If she wants to be the nurturing type why can't she just love and nurture the people already in her life? You don't need a baby to do that. It's one thing to prefer a child in your life but it's another thing for your whole self-identity and confidence to be based on one single act
You'd be surprised at how many women carry these values.
So I asked the mod about this and they reassured me that the rumors were bs.>>>/meta/2405
Sorry for causing confusion
What is wrong with what that anon said? Not liking sluts?
Interesting, this exact scenario happened to a friend of mine who was COMPLETELY supportive of the transition, thought they would get married and wanted children, suddenly everything became about her boyfriend's new needs and he started announcing things without her and making big choices without even mentioning it to her (like giving up his fertility before saving sperm in case they wanted children together.)and eventually just broke up with her and started dating some dude. She was there for him and did everything within her power to be a good partner and in the end it wasn't enough because he wanted the full "female experience" and she wasn't in a position to provide him with the gender role he was looking to play. It made me really sad and angry because suddenly it's this whole parade for them and they're the star of the show and god help you if you have anything against them or expect them to ever care about your side of the experience. He just tossed her to the curb without a second thought after he was bored of being a "lesbian".
The other part that bothers me is my mum was sexually abused as a child and she has a right to use the women's restroom as a private safe space. She doesn't know how to respond to all this as being a conservative christian, she instantly gets shut down by other family members for having a different opinion. not even a fully formed strong opinion like we have here, she doesn't know what to make of it really, and simply doesn't wanna share a bathroom with what she perceives as men. That's why I think separate gender neutral bathrooms are essential and not just suddenly sharing our spaces whether we like it or not.
I still try very hard to be understanding and compassionate but certain things just don't sit right with me. To be fair I've only met like one trans person, this wasn't really a thing when I was a kid or even in high school.
I haven't met many transpeople, around 7 I guess.
1 transmen and the rest were transwomen. The transmen was a little bit off, but otherwise okay.
All transwomen on the other hand were more than creepy. They always wore clothes no one in his right mind would wear. Like a choker with spikes and chains, or half naked dress, if you could call it that, to a family friendly convention. They often act so weird and they have a very uncomfortable aura, you just don't want to be around them.
I was supportive of them, but after meeting them in person and reading a lot about them, I can't anymore.
Body dysphoria may be real, but the treatment we have at the moment is not the one we should use. We should help them getting in terms with their body and mind.
So no, they shouldn't be here, they are men.
Which is ironic, because trans ideology is regressive as hell. It demands that people mutilate their bodies to match the fashion and memes that they like.
>you too can experience female menstrual cycle with one simple trick
There are like 5 "trannie hate" generals on this board
i used to be pretty against them, because of shit like >>51375 >>51374
but now that i'm older, i realize retarded behavior is not unique to trans women. my other reason for being against it–e.g. it's a mental illness that is more damaging to them than helpful–has sort of faded too. i mean, if a dude sees his body and it causes him so much mental trauma that he wishes he was a chick, and goes off to get surgery to become a chick, then that isn't any of my business. let 'em live their best lives or whatever
that being said i do think that if the man isn't experiencing dysphoria, then they aren't really trans…sort of like, if a gay guy called himself "gay" but had no attraction to COCK and men. the brain stuff isn't there so wtf bro
>>51380>isn't any of my business
The thing issss, they don't mind their fuckin business. They're actively in my business, policing my every word because just uttering the word "ovary" triggers them. Also they want common people like you and I to pay for their fake boobs and nose job.>>51378
This is the designated trans thread per moderation
I'd bet my legs this isn't actually a tranny and just a false flagger trying to trigger le epic raid
i mean, to come back to this, there is a big difference between an actual trans woman and an incel that has taken "the pink pill" and hopes their life will be less miserable if they become a lady (for purely social reasons)
>>51562>i mean, to come back to this, there is a big difference between an actual trans woman and an incel that has taken "the pink pill"
They’re still both men tho
first time hearing from this website (used to browse other IBs but they were mostly very rude) and glad to see finally a really nice space for women to discuss issues we face. i find it disgusting that trannies try to fit into the spaces since they don't expierience the struggles women do. i'm glad the mods also understand that and bless this thread for all the queens who don't want trannies ruining this shit board. i hope this will be the last tranny thread i see here because all the other threads are lovely
I didnt hate trannies. I didnt mind them. Up until I started being seriously friends with some. The FtM trannies are just usually annoying and whinny. I haven't met any FtMs that aren't whiny yet. One of my dear friends that used to be female came out as trans not so long ago. I tried to accept it of course and we're still friends, but since she came out as trans she keeps talking to me about how much she wants to physically hurt her girlfriend and how much she likes jerking off to gory shit. In the end I'm getting tired of comforting their every trans needs but I can't just stop or else I'm TRaNSpHobIC !!! and that would risk losing a friendship which is fine outside of the trans bullshit.
But the MtFs are different. They've always been creepy with me, and I can't help but be scared of them. I remember one MtF tranny coming to see me from another country just to try to fuck me. I was 16 at the time and didnt understand (and didnt know the consequences of telling someone where you live, I know I'm stupid.) Some others MtFs trannies I've known were always just unconfortably close to me and wanted to know "female related things" about me. They tried to act like females but ended up acting like an anime caricature (He was also wearing anime dresses to uni), I'm honestly convinced it must be a sexual thing for them since I remember one particurlarly sending me hentai multiple times. It's as if they have no self-awareness since they can always use the "TRANSPHOBE" buzzword whenever and however they please.
In the end, this made me hate trannies. Maybe I just met the "bad apples" as a bunch of people try to tell me but it still doesnt change that every tranny I've met has been deranged in some way. Its like they can never separate their personality with their trans-identity.
tl;dr: I wouldn't hate trannies if all the trannies I've met weren't deranged in some way.
Welcome, anon! I discovered this imageboard in much the same scenario. Hope you enjoy your stay.
This twitter thread was an absolute disaster lmao. There were these "trans" people getting incredibly racist just because someone said something like "I'd rather my girlfriend not have a willy" and of course, telling the cisgender to go kill themselves.
MtF ‘lesbian’ tranny posted this meme in a discord server I’m in (other trannies positively reacted to this meme), and it further validates many assumptions I make about their… kind…
In the end its just a form of self harm.They'll eventually stop by realising they could have just accepted their bodies from the beginning and not bother with any of this bullshit. Or they keep ruining it even more and be miserable forever.
whoopsy i made that post yes indeed was a typo but thought nobody would notice
i ment to say that trannies turn all boards into shit boards and yes indeed it is a nice /comfy/ website. it's not as rude and hateful as other websites with many girl users, it's not all gossipy and most girls here seem very smart and educated >>51615
thank you i feel very welcome <3
I'd recommend leaving that server before more of whatever that shit is ensues or is condoned. For your own good, anon.
like you i think i'm pretty lucky, all of my experiences with trans people have been very positive, and my friend who is now trans even talked me out of suicide years ago. I've even use the bathroom with a trans girl before and literally nothing happened, all she did was fix her eyebrows, wipe down the counter and walk out and i felt really bad for thinking that something would happen. >>51380
>>51652>I've even use the bathroom with a trans girl before and literally nothing happened, all she did was fix her eyebrows, wipe down the counter and walk out and i felt really bad for thinking that something would happen.
Most trans identified people won't do anything. It's not trans people that worry radfems (not like this anyway). It's the fact that it means that it's very easy for men to be accepted into women's toilets and women can't say anything if they feel uncomfortable until one of them is assaulted. In unisex toilets women are much more likely to be assaulted. This is what trans right terrorists always miss or refuse to see. You were not wrong to be afraid that something might happen but if they really were trans identified it's unlikely something would. You can't really tell though without knowing them. Even just this rational fear is why there should be a third toilet for trans. Women shouldn't be fearful in toilets.
It's fine if you don't mind, but what if another woman didn't feel comfortable about having a man in a secluded room with her while her pants are down? In today's world she has to shut the fuck up for the sake of the guy. That's not okay, and that's the point. You shouldn't have to place men's feelings before women's in a women-only space.
I kinda wish I had more positive experiences with trans people. I can see how my negative experiences ended up making me hate them, even if I do try to put them aside when I meet a new person that happens to be trans.
I'm glad this isn't normalized here, I can't imagine having to deal with meeting trannies all the time.
If you don't want to hear about the gf abuse and gore, use her own illness against her. Tell her that now that you see her as a man, you don't feel comfortable hearing about her sex life/hurting women/etc. She sound focus on the former part and accept the latter more easily.
Not sure why you put up with this though. If a normal female friend told me she wanted to physically abuse her bf I would tell her to cut that shit out, or at least to keep her weird fetishes to herself.
They´re not just not women, they´re barely human at that point. An abomination and an affront to nature.
Every doctor that has ever done a so called reassignment surgery has violated their hippocratic oath and ought to be treated like Josef Mengele.
>sees a random beautiful anime/game girl that guys and girls drool over even though she's not the most endowed
>"she must be trans!"
>>52464>this character must be trans because she does things that literally a majority of the population does
If anything being obsessed about food is 100% an anime girl thing.
I'm in this post and I don't like it>>52470>>52464
Isn't every stacy obsessed with pizza or am did I get stuck in 2010
omg i hope more REAL women start to speak out against troons. im so sick of them legit silencing us and using their privilage as men to larp as a woman and feel what its like to be oppressed cause its part of their sicko fetish. some of my friends are on board with this feeling.
and im also friends with a few trannies… but. idk how to break it to em. i still like respect them but i want to tell them they should stop while they can. i think this guy i know has like mommy issues or something and wants to try to get his mom to like him so maybe hes larping as a girl. But i dunno.
Personally, I’ve only interacted with three trans people that I know of.
1. FTM. Seems relatively normal and has a girlfriend. Definitely appears to copy bits of his male personality from the guys in his friend group, but if I had to build a new personality from scratch I’d probably do the same thing. I only talked with him once but he’s fine enough.
2. MTF A job interview for a bank. Opened with her pronouns and I responded with mine. I’m not a pronoun person but it seemed like a polite thing to do. Job interview went really well and apparently the interviewer liked me enough I even got a scholarship from the bank afterwards. All in all, they were okay, at least enough to hold a professional interview.
3. MTF literally one of the most narcissistic, aggressive, creepy people I’ve ever met. We had a couple of writing classes in uni together and no shit, all the stories they wrote were about vaginal discharge and lesbians. I’m not exaggerating. This dude straight up submitted a story for our whole class to read about white vaginal discharge leaking into the character’s underwear. I think at one point the character dried crushed and sniffed it. This person would also call out other men for writing female characters that felt “inauthentic” lol. They constantly dressed in garish blue and pink, were like 100lbs overweight, and had an awful bowl haircut.
And saying that his story is garbage makes you a "transphobe".
also the "plot" of that vaginal discharge story was about a girl who goes through people's phones to look for porn. like the other 50% of his story was about internet porn. i swear these stereotypes just write themselves. deep down, i think i do want to be more sympathetic to people with gender dysphoria, but if i include the ones i've seen online, a good majority of MTFs are extremely creepy. they tend to be obsessed with anime and hentai, porn, and becoming this weird ditsy stereotype of a loli girl. also virtually all the MTFs ive met were white. i wonder why that is
>>52515>also virtually all the MTFs ive met were white. i wonder why that is
White people are the most accepting of trans people?
The most susceptible to mental illness FTFY
Isn't it fucked up that eating disorders are often disproportionately blamed on the media, flattening a complex and multifaceted issue into hysterical females being too delicate to not succumb to advertisers' messaging, but to even suggest that media could be a factor in some people identifying as trans is transphobic and invalidating?
The connection between the "transgender" phenomenon and popular media should definitely be researched more, but what about "transgender" people who'd never heard of the phenomenon, never met any "trans" people, and simply felt predominately more connected to the opposite sex throughout life? Those cases aren't as common (most trannies only "discover" that they're trans after discovering another tranny) but they do exist.
I'm not trying to say those cases don't exist, I think they definitely do, which is why I said "a factor in SOME people identifying as trans". Like EDs I think that "transness", such as it is, is a complicated phenomenon with a lot of layers, that people clearly come to via many different paths. It's just unfortunate that it's become taboo to talk about any other path besides muh brain sex/muh inner feelings of gender.
I apologize if my reply sounded accusatory, it wasn't meant to be and I understand what you mean. I agree, and I wonder what would happen to the "transgender movement" if it could somehow be documented/was revealed that most people who identify as transgender only do so because they became aware of a person, in real life or in fictional media, who also identified as such.
It's what happens when you accept that it's an identity instead of a mental illness.
I feel like the trans community, including you, perpetuate this notion that trans women are indistinguishable from normal women in all but two ways (penis, genetics). In reality, trans women are more like a third class of person that more often than not comes with a host of mental disorders and outcast traits. Like the incidence of MTFs with autism, narcissism, furries, porn addiction, and being mentally trapped in an anime hentai world is uncomfortably high.
I'm fine with trans girls, I have two close online friends who are trans girls and I care about them a lot. I've always felt however, that womenhood is something that you're subjected to as opposed to something you can gradually opt into. The experience of the average woman is nothing like the experience of the average trans woman. Most if not all the struggles I've faces have been because I was a woman, I was never given the chance to opt into this.
i feel this.
you never really hear issues of trans women being attacked for being "women", always that they are trans
anon I used to feel this way, but I just hate em now! I don't want to be lying to myself, I cut them out of my life. they all have autogynephilia and you cant change my mind. every single one I meet is so obsessed with getting validated. they will never understand what it is to be a woman. they just want to be sex objects and fuckable.
I'm just tired of it sorry for rant.
I feel you so much. No matter how much I try to understand trans women I always end up running into the creepy ones. I know the whole "not all of them have autogynephilia" but the vast majority does from what I've seen.
Adding on to my rant sorry.. It’s also funny how they claim cis people only have one joke but the gag is that the majority of them look like scraggly men dressed in 12yr olds attire sporting a frizzy balding bob or a frizzy high pony tail. I’ve gotten to the point where I do want to call them out and call out my friends for being ok with the blatantly misogyny going on. The literal silencing of women. Men will never be women. Troons will never ever EVER be women EVER. And I really hope they feel threatened by us in c.c. Troons are not welcome and no matter how well you pass you’re still very clockable and I can’t wait for more women to realize it. I will never sympathize with troons and I don’t think I feel bad. Troons I’ve interacted with have been more violentl than cis men that I know. Ok rant officially over. (Sorry)
I'm becoming more and more convinced it's a mostly predators following a new and even easier script to get access to victims. It's a real shame because I don't mind trans people who aren't in denial and know they aren't women, but want to look like one. Too bad the majority are just perverts who are mentally ill. Society needs to stop kidding themselves and call them for what they are.
Nice hand size dude.
Get the fuck out of here tranny. Don't you see this is female only website? If you have been victim of something then this is cause you're a pussy ass fag, stop trying to pretend you are as physically vulnerable as a woman. You are only "sexually harassed" by freak faggots just like you
Lmao men hate you for being an ugly faggot, not for being a woman
Lol @ trannies thinking that they’re welcome here. Get the fuck out of cc and our bathrooms.
>hurr im the opposite sex cuz i feel so, and im going to cut myself
>not a mental illness
kinda like how the pro ana mindset work. Can i be transage? transrace? transformer?
i love that the qualifications page doesn't actually list any qualifications
Someone should take posts like these, remove the trans part, and repost it on reddit to see how the reaction would change. I bet most users would defend the OP and not the person who masturbates while wearing her underwear.
I think they could turn the post into a genuine lesbian relationship, preserve the mental illness and psychological dependence aspect (chalk it up to depression and ptsd or bpd or anything else) and the reaction would still be outrage on the OP's behalf.
Transwoman are not woman. Never will be. I am so confused that we even have to say that.
I have one trans woman in my pen and paper group (it is a big open group for beginners) and he looks like the stereotypical trannie.
Very long uncept hair with a huge forehead. Long nails. Chocker, uwu kawai dresses and his man boobs are in a extrem push up brah that makes them look just not right.
He tries to speak in a super awkward female voice that males him sound like he has breathing porblems. (He has none)
But I tried and talked to him for some meetings. Turns out he only like hyped feminine stupid character. He overxeualised everything. Hentai addict for sure.
That was not the first transsexual I met. I have met some and all where creepy people, it did not matter if they passed or not. If you talked longer with then they always where not right in the head.
That comes from a person with friends consist out of depressed people, people with borderline and one schizophrenic person.
I think when you ask normies about "trans rights," it's one of those things that everyone supports as a broad general idea but it's hard to pick specific examples the closer you look into it. Everyone likes supporting trans people "as an idea," but ask them to name any specific experiences with trans people and that's where it gets murky. I'd honestly bet that for the majority of people, even normies, their trans people they've met have been creepy hentai-addicted men who envisioned themselves as lolis.
Also, why do all trannies type in that weird cooing and mewling keyboard-smashing way when they're horny or trying to be funny. is it some form of internalized patheticness they've accepted as part of their culture?https://old.reddit.com/r/traaNSFW/
>>55410>I mean I’m lesbian but I still like fucking men
From literally the first thread I clicked on, what kind of reality are those people living in
I guess i’m one of the few who disagrees, lol. I’ve met a few creeps, and a few who are just otherwise normal women. One of them is a good friend, and i’m glad to know her because I was kind of starting to lose hope myself.
>>55425>a few who are just otherwise normal women
But your friend isn’t a woman.
As far as i and anyone else who knows her is concerned, she is. If you want to call her something different then fine, I don’t really want to argue semantics. But from my point of view she’s a wonderful person who lacks the organs to produce male gametes and has a phenotype generally consistent with people who produce ova, so to me calling her a man just seems like mental gymnastics and I don’t see any point in it
>>55427>he’s a wonderful person who lacks the organs to produce male gametes
Because he cut them out of his body.
>has a phenotype generally consistent with women
Because he cut himself up to look like a woman.
Women are not incomplete men. A man who mutilates himself is not a woman.
Of course. But I consider her as she is now rather than how she used to be, and how she came into her physiology doesn’t really have much bearing on my opinion.
Never did say that women are incomplete men. We’re not entirely different species, we’re two phenotypes of the same species built on the same basic template. You have your opinion which is likely influenced by bad experiences and that’s understandable, but knowing her the way I do, I simply can’t agree with your point of view. The woman I know is, to me and everyone else in our social circle, simply that. You won’t agree with me and that’s fine. The thread asked for opinions and i’m simply sharing mine.
>>55427>she’s a wonderful person who lacks the organs to produce male gametes and has a phenotype generally consistent with people who produce ova, so to me calling her a man just seems like mental gymnastics
Are eunuchs girls too now? If a guy lost his cock and balls to cancer and shaved his face and grew his hair out would that make him a woman too?
I can't get behind any sort of arguement for MtF trans people being women. I'll respect their pronouns in their presence out of politeness but everyone gets they aren't really women when you get down to it. I'm not a woman because I decided I liked dresses and the color pink and wanted tits one day, I'm a woman cause I was born into it. It's like race, you can't opt in/out of your race, you just are it. If a white guy told me he identified as Chinese I wouldn't believe he's actually chinese even if he did have bodily disphoria, so I dunno why I'm espected to listen to a man when he tells me he identifies as a girl.
Here, have a refreshing glass of Sunny Delight. What do you mean, no? It's sweet and it's orange. It's phenotypically the same. Drink up.
Are women just sexual organs and reproductive facilities now?
Where did I say that?
Women are just what they are, adult humans born with vaginas. If you were born with a cock and raised as a man you aren't one. Simple as that.
Eunuchs don’t have phenotypes consistent with people who produce ova and retain their penises, they don’t have the tissues rearranged into their homologous structures.
>>55433>raised as a man
No such thing.
>>55427>has a phenotype generally consistent with people who produce ova
But your friend’s new “phenotype” is completely artificial. Let me ask you something: how do you define the word “woman”? What is “womanhood”? Your friend will always be a man, no matter how he medically alters his body.>>55432
Women are adult human females. You’re trying to imply that defining women by their sex is somehow dehumanizing. It’s not. What makes a woman a woman is her female body.>>55435
What do you mean “no such thing”? Are you denying that men and women are socialized differently growing up? Because they certainly are.. not sure what mental gymnastics you will use to deny that.
Why do the changes being artificial mean that she’s a man? Regardless of how she came into her physiology, it is what it is.
I define the word “woman” the same as it’s defined in the dictionary and in practice. An adult human who produces ova. Failing this, an adult human who has a phenotype largely consistent with someone who produces ova and otherwise does not produce sperm or have the organs to do so.
>>55431>comparing two phenotypes of the same species to a drink and a bottle of rain treatment
>>55446>an adult human who has a phenotype largely consistent with someone who produces ova>Implying MtFs look like women
Growing moobs and carving an open wound into your crotch don't make you a girl, sorry.
Not an open wound. And I didn’t say that it does alone. This individual isn’t just a man with breasts and a neovagina, her musculature and skeleton is female-typical as well. At this point arguing over whether to call her a woman or a man is purely semantics, I simply choose to use the descriptor that is most practical because there’s no way I can bring myself to view her as a man given what i’ve observed.
I dont hate trannies in general. theyre so rare irl that I think you can pick and choose which ones you accept and which ones you dont. the ones who are uggo middle aged pedo creeps, I dont knowledge as women, the ones who seem genuine I do
realistically I can count on onw hand how many Ive seen irl, so Im not worried theyre going to overrun society or anything like that
>>55446>Why do the changes being artificial mean that she’s a man?
Why does Rachel Dolezal tanning her skin and braiding her hair not make her black? Because Rachel Dolezal is white and your friend is a man.>an adult human who has a phenotype largely consistent with someone who produces ova
So being a woman depends on how one looks? Ok, so, to you, a TiM is only a woman if he passes? Is a TiM who can’t afford hormones and plastic surgery still a man then? I think they’re men either way, since a woman must be female to be a woman.>>55449>there’s no way I can bring myself to view her as a man given what i’ve observed.
So you’re prioritizing your anecdotal experience with a TiM over common sense.>>55450>the ones who seem genuine I do
What is a “woman,” then?
>>55451>What is a “woman,” then?
Im not going to come up with some sort of technical definition. I will say that on an individual level, someone who presents themselves as a woman earnestly in terms of appearance and general female "vibe", who is nice, I will treat with the respect of calling them a girl
I dont care about their dicks or whatever, just like I dont care about my real female friends vaginas
Tanning your skin isn’t really comparable to the biological effects that my friend has experienced as a result of transition. Female typical musculoskeletal system, secondary sex characteristics, Andy metabolic profile indicate a female-typical pattern of genetic expression.
>is an MtF who can’t afford surgery and hormones a man
Yes. If they don’t have the means to alter their physiology to a more female-typical state and ablate male primary sex characteristics then they retain physiology which more practically places them under the male category.
>>55454>Female typical musculoskeletal system
This has to be a troll
No, i’m being honest. She just isn’t built like a man.
>>55456>No, i’m being honest. She just isn’t built like a man.
I wanted to say that I disagree with you but that I am happy that you found a nice one.
(Statistically there has to be some)
But that sentence and >>55454
is just a big no.
There are feminime man and masculine woman. Just because they aren't build like stereotypes doesn't invalid that.
That is one of my main porblem with the trans cult.
As soon as one person doesn't fit in the male or female stereotype he or she is not male or female.
Screw that, I know a woman with bigger muscles in her arm that the average man. She is build like a guy. Doesn't mean she should be a guy.
I’m not talking about stereotypes, it annoys me when people assume that women can’t be strong, e.g. all the fuss about TLOU2 saying Abby is trans when she’s modeled after a UFC fighter who’s a normal woman. I’m not just saying she’s thin and small though, i’m saying that her skeleton and general form reads as a normal woman. When I first met her I was kind of surprised by her general attitude towards mainstream “trans activism,” she’s embarrassed by it, I would be too. She’s never attempted to hijack the conversation in the feminist circle we’re a part of and makes some valuable contributions to the conversation. I’m not going to go around saying TWAW or whatever but this individual definitely is.
>>55454>Tanning your skin isn’t really comparable to the biological effects (…) as a result of transition
The biological effects that result from transition, like gynecomastia or a shrunken dick, do not make a man into a woman. Who are you to say that Rachel Dolezal isn’t black, if she has made her appearance more similar to a black person’s? Why is transgenderism more valid than transracialism?>Yes. If they don’t have the means to alter their physiology to a more female-typical state and ablate male primary sex characteristics then they retain physiology which more practically places them under the male category.
Nice word salad. You could’ve just said “no, I don’t believe TiMs who don’t pass are women.” The majority of TiMs who go on HRT do not experience many physical changes unless they start very young. So, what about these TiMs who start HRT as adults? Are they women if they don’t pass and don’t have significant bodily changes? What about TiMs who DID start young and DO have bodily changes, but still don’t visually pass as women? Your definition of “woman” is faulty and unreliable. The only defintion that makes sense is “adult human female.”
>I’m referring moreso to the effects that take place at a cellular level
It's embarrassing enough that men fall for the 'E is Magic' meme. Women falling for it is dumber. Your boyfriend is male at the cellular level. Replace his titty skittles with regular skittles for a few months and you'll see it.
Hormones =/= gender
If taking estrogen makes you a girl than I guess women who have too much testosterone from pcos are men.
Your friend is living out his mental illness and you're just enabling him.
>>55521>Why is transgenderism more valid than transracialism?
This is what I really don't get about people who try to brush off this comparison like the anon who's talking with you has. Literally WHY isn't it "practical and or accurate" (to quote >>55536 ) to call someone who's gone through enough surgeries to pass as another race the race they've "transitioned" to? If Rachael Dolezal passed better (because she looks rough lmao), would these people okay with calling her black? What makes sex unique in this respect?
I wanted to chime in with this exact point. I think so many people are desensitized to the typical tranny arguments just because they get repeated ad nauseum, but it becomes clearer how ridiculous they are when you apply it to race (or even age). Like say there's an 80 year old woman who wants to be 25 years old again– so she gets extensive surgeries and face lifts to make her skin appear younger. But nothing about her surgeries can change the fact that an 80 year old woman's body does not have the same womb / ovaries and bone density as a 25 year old. Even if everyone she meets face to face tells her "yes you look 25 years old" that doesn't mean she is.
Yet somehow, with trannies it's magically different.
Well technically you could consider miss dolezal “Black” if you’re just accounting for skin color, assuming she managed to actually increase the level of melanin in her skin. Not a person of African descent, though, since that’s describing where your family is from. As for age, I guess if you somehow found a way to halt the normal aging and development processes, you could consider a person who uses this to retain the body of a child to be a child. But it wouldn’t be accurate to say they’re 5 years old, since that’s strictly a measure of how long you’ve existed.
>I'm not dating her
Then get off her dick.
I think this thread is harmed by the lack of visual photos for reference. This is a picture of a trans meetup. Would you say that the majority of these people pass?
>>55536>I’m referring moreso to the effects that take place at a cellular level
All trans-identified men have XY chromosomes in their DNA. There is nothing at the “cellular level” that makes them women. An increase of estrogen might make a man’s body change (e.g. a TiM developing gynecomastia from HRT), but that does not make them women, it simply makes them men with excess estrogen.
>>55536>To clarify, when I say woman, I do mean adult human female. Never contested that definition. To me it just isn’t practical or accurate to class the person in question as a male.
So you agree that your friend is a man? I understand calling him a “woman” from a practical standpoint. For example, if he passes as a woman it wouldn’t make sense to call him a “he” when pointing him out from a crowd to a stranger. He’s still a man though.>>55567>Well technically you could consider miss dolezal “Black” if you’re just accounting for skin color, assuming she managed to actually increase the level of melanin in her skin. Not a person of African descent, though, since that’s describing where your family is from.
No one will ever consider Rachel Dolezal black, but for some reason people will consider men women. “Black” and “African descent” are synonyms anyway. She’s just a tanned white lady with braids, just like how TiMs are men taking estrogen pills.
Why do they look like Steven Universe fans?
Furthermore, "being black" isn't literally just your skin color, it's how that affects your life and how you grow up and how people treat you and the state of your community. Similarly there's more to "being a woman" than just having tits and a gash, and a dude who gets surgery to have those traits hasn't grown up being treated like a girl for 20 years to really have any say or expertise in the matter.
Honestly, I think trannies are a bigger presence than the trans-black rachel dolezals of the world simply because black people won't hesitate to beat the shit out of a white guy who claim's he's trans-black. Meanwhile all these incels arent afraid of women beating them up, especially as most women are more outspokenly liberal and accepting which places them into the pro-trans camp by default
i think they look more like the background characters in a Shrek spinoff
I don't disagree with this, but I know people might argue back with shit like "what if a female/black person was raised in [insert extraordinary circumstances here] where they haven't been treated differently for being female/black? Are they still female/black?". I would argue that those people seem get all this shit backwards. Being black is just genetics that make a person develop melanated skin and all the other physical traits associated with that group. Same for being female, but with making ovaries and all those other female traits. Just because society/history has associated all these auxiliary things like clothes/stereotypes/social norms doesn't mean you can reverse engineer a woman/black person by adopting those auxiliary things.
Sidenote: people using the word "phenotype" tilts the fuck outta me. I guess I kinda get the confusion, I remember it being described to me in highschool as "what an organism looks like versus what their genes are" or whatever the fuck, but it doesn't literally mean what it LOOKS like. It refers to how an organism's physiology relates to it's genetics. For example, you can say that a dog that's homozygous for black fur and a dog heterozygous for black fur (and we can pretend black fur is the dominant gene in this example) both have the same phenotype of growing black fur despite having differing genotypes. You can't
just bleach one of those dogs and say it has a "blond phenotype", just like you can't invert some guy's dick and say that's a "female phenotype". I get it, you're trying to sound smart while arguing for trans people, but you sound retarded using words you don't know the meaning of.
>So? In the absence of testicular tissue, the Y isn't doing much of anything.
So what if it isn't "doing anything"? It's still there.
>Female-typical physiology induced by HRT, e.g. musculature and secondary characteristics, indicates a female-typical pattern of genetic expression
Just because your friend has artificially altered his body does not make him a woman. A man taking estrogen does not make him a woman. I am not solely using chromosomes to determine sex, but the overwhelming majority of people's sex can be determined by their chromosomes.
>When did I say that?
You said that when you said you believed that a woman is an adult human female.
>my friend is and adult human female
Your friend is a man. Taking estrogen does not make a man into a female. What sort of mental gymnastics is this?
>There is no "african descent" gene pathway present in those of european ancestry that can be activated.
What about it?
>>9156> thread bump
honestly, they are such a small matter and i feel like it should constantly be remembered they are < .6 percent of the population. in light of recent migration, it‘s off putting when cafe goers obsess over them so much. i know crystal cafe is openly terfy because of lolcow/gender crit, but as long as they don’t flood female spaces or spam about their identity… i feel like i’m in the sub-section of lurking femanons who secretly don’t mind them at all, although maybe it could be argued that this is said in ignorance. they’re basically considered of the lowest stratum of society already, why do we bother ourselves with worrying about them?
>No, I didn’t.
Yes you did. In this >>55536 post:
“To clarify, when I say woman, I do mean adult human female. Never contested that definition.”
I don’t care if calling your friend a man/male isn’t “practical.” He is a male, therefore he is a man.
>I look at her and observe a fairly typical woman who possesses a body largely consistent with people who produce ova and which does not and cannot produce sperm.
I don’t care what he looks like. I don’t care if he artificially gave himself the features that women effortlessly, naturally have. Your friend is a man. Womanhood is not something that can be obtained through plastic surgery and horse hormones. It is a biological reality present at birth.
>>55586>as long as they don’t flood female spaces or spam about their identity
They don't do that here because they aren't allowed to. Give them an inch and you end up like Reddit, where half the mods of women's boards are men with shitty dye jobs and they ban you for saying that kids shouldn't be shot up with hormones.
Would you stop with the "friend" bullshit? You're clearly talking about yourself.
>There is no "african descent" gene pathway present in those of european ancestry that can be activated.
Citation needed? Just looking at skin pigmentation alone, light skin developed after
groups humans migrated to latitudes farther from the equator. Are you saying someone who has light skin because of a down-regulation of melanin production can claim a different race if they take hormones that up melanin production to levels associated with said race?>>55582
Probably true :(
Yes, he is. :)
Your friend is biologically male, referring to them as male may be hurtful for him and I understand you wanting to shield him from this, but it's the truth.
Lots of people are so obsessed with trans that they won't stop posting about it, it's everywhere
I feel sorry for any kids who are being raised on the internet
they can fuck off for all i care
You're not fooling me, scrote. It's easy to tell by the way you type. Begone.
And yes, you are male.
Typical troon. Imagine being so obsessed with being allowed in every woman’s space that you’re personally offended by women talking about a medical disorder that literally cannot affect anyone who doesn’t have ovaries. Wow, silencing women talking about their own bodies. How male of them.
Honestly, I think this is why it’s important to enforce an anti-trans board culture. It’s like how 4chan is reputed for being one of the most racist, sexist places on the Internet, but because of that it has maintained the same culture (more or less) for the last 10 years. Newfags unaccustomed to the language and mannerisms who post before acclimating themselves are immediately called niggers and faggots, which serves to drive away most people who would otherwise water down and shift the culture if allowed to participate.
On the other hand, look at reddit. In the last 6 years it’s gone from a content aggregator that was pretty good at making and collecting interesting pics and stories, to a diluted bland mess of fictional clickbait feel-good stories and political low effort shitposting. Any good community that springs up is eventually overwhelmed by the same dilution of taste. If you give normies an inch they’ll take a mile, just because there’s so many more of them and their voices will average out towards the mean. Reddit is basically 9gag now but worse. If you’ve used the site for a while you probably can see how subs that used to be interesting catered content (that’s insane, nature is fucking lit, next fucking level, pics, aww) have all regressed towards the same handful of low effort topics (vaccines and socialism and Sanders and Keanu and autism are good. Trump and science deniers and Karens and republicans and antivaxxers are bad). Shit, they don’t even have memes anymore, any meme sub has become overrun with the same shitty format of [picture demonstrating something that is either good or bad] / [picture affirming Reddit’s consensus opinion on if it’s good or bad]. Every time a new meme good sub springs up (deep fried memes, okay buddy retard), at around the 30,000 sub mark it again gets overrun by these hordes of normies who’ve never made an original joke in their life.
Anyway. I know this is a long post full of tangents. But what I mean to say is IT IS IMPORTANT THAT WE MAKE CLEAR: TRANNIES ARE NOT WELCOME HERE. Post this message loud and clear, make sure this thread or another anti-trans thread is constantly on the front page of /b/. Because it’s really, really easy for the culture of an online community to slowly shift without anyone realizing, but once you’ve become infested with normies or trannies it’s literally impossible to go back. There’s always gonna be more of them.
Also regarding reddit: keep in mind that only 0.6% of the population is trans. For 1000 people, only 6 of them are trans. For 100 people, basically 1 of them.
Now take a look at Reddit’s lgbt sub. If you really want to get into it, sort by the top of the past year or so. NEARLY HALF THE POSTS ARE FROM MTF TRANNIES TALKING ABOUT SPINNY SKIRTS AND THEIR TITS. I’m not even exaggerating. https://www.reddit.com/r/lgbt/top?t=year
No shit the gays and lesbians kept trying to make their own offshoots (LGB drop the T, true lesbians vs actual lesbians). It’s because trannies are so self obsessed they need to jam themselves like a square peg into a round neovagina in every single community. It’s like “ oh on the LGBT totem pole we’re the most oppressed, therefore WE need the most attention and support”
Fuck, I feel bad for the lesbian sub that got banned, I think something like half the mod team was trannies and there’s a latent sub culture of “Make sure you support ALL lesbians! If you don’t date someone because of their genitals you’re not a real lesbian! :)” Of course, these transbians don’t date each other, they want “real girls” to shove their mutilated wounds against.
God, I just hate trannies so fucking much. They feel this obsessive compulsive need to be the center of attention in every single scenario. They make women’s issues about them. They make women’s spaces about them. TRANNIES ARE NOT WELCOME HERE. THIS SITE IS FOR WOMEN ONLY, NOT MENTALLY DERANGED PERVERTS WITH 30 TERABYTES OF HENTAI ON THEIR PC.
No trannies. We don't owe you our spaces. Get your own spaces.
They’ve already taken over reddit, infest nearly every popular discord, force themselves into video games, speed running, and programming to a bizarrely high degree, and have centered the main LGBT dialogue onto the right to chop off their dicks. I’d say they have plenty of space. In fact, they honestly need less space.
I hate trooners so much I can't stop posting about it
God always the same fucking subject. The same fucking retarded questions
well this was a depressing way to find out that r/truelesbians got banned.
i'm legit sad lmao 99% of the content there was just a space to talk about hobbies and get lesbian-specific advice, i met some cool people on there (who i wish i had a way to contact now). it wasn't even a gc circlejerk, obv was made for real lesbians but being gender critical wasnt the focus, it was just comfy.
fuck, anyone here know of alternatives? i regret leaving the radfem discord now.
I understand you so very much.
What is the most funny to me it that transsexuals are so few, but what about people with disability.
Everyone tries to kiss their butt and make them "Feel comfortable" these poor children.
What about blind people or people who are visually impaired. Mute or deaf people. People in wheelchairs? Depression?
No forget those people, trannies need to get their surgical payed and we need gender neutral bathrooms.
If money would go to found better treatments I wouldn't mind it that much. But oh, how dare you to NOT try to help! You try to literally kill them!
ARGH. I am so fed up and would like to ignore them, but they are EVERYWHERE. In every hobby, internet site doesn't matter. They are there screeching and being creepy. Urgh.
Sorry for the rant, but you can't really talk about them in public, so here is one of the few sites where you can rant in peace.
That is why this topic is brought up so often.
I think at the heart of their movement is a backlash to a backlash. Trannies are probably the one thing that nearly everyone from the right to normies to the far left are unified on hating and feeling a natural instinctive disgust towards. Therefore the movement to support them gets disproportionately blown up larger. I mean, just look at how common the tranny talking points are in culture and media: gender neutral bathrooms, letting trannies play in women’s sports, allowing them to get hormones and surgeries, letting them induct prepubescent children into their cult at such a young age. Statistically, there’s really no good reason that 0.6% of the population should take up so much of the media dialogue. It’s just that so many diverse political viewpoints are unified in hating them, from basically everyone right of Obama and everyone left of radfems, the moderate left basically tasked itself with defending trannies nearly day and night. Trannies see this disproportionate media support as a golden ticket to invade and infest every corner of the internet that hasn’t explicitly said it’s for them. Oh, you’re a women’s only app? That’s cool… but do you allow TRANS women???? See: Giggle (there’s another thread up about it now).
Lol isn’t this the dude known for posting “ditsy wittwe girl” shit on reddit?
>simply because it sells
Sports Illustrated's swimsuit issue is softcore porn for normie males. I'm really interested in finding out what sales stats for the futa issue were like and what subscription rates are now that they ran it. Compsci hons have deep pockets, but that doesn't mean their shit flies outside of their internet enclaves.
>ratty t shirt
>mismatched ugly clothing
We need to talk about this and it needs to change.
That’s a tranny. Nice try tho.
Preface: My attiudes towards trans people aren't as critical as many of the anons here. They used to be but not really anymore.
Anyway, I'm really annoyed that many online LGBT and left-leaning spaces for political discussion has been overtaken by trans discourse. I can't really vent about this elsewhere so I'm doing it here. I can't go on a forum for politics for general LGBT stuff without seeing trans shit first and foremost. Why is it that trans people make up 0.5% of the general population, but trans-related shit makes up 50%+ more of the posts in these spaces? I want to be sympathetic, but I'm really starting to not be when they're so in-your-face about it in discussions that are barely trans-related. It's especially the case with MtFs (which really doesn't help dismiss stereotypes about them being attention-seeking).
Gays and lesbians are much more accepted now than when the LGBT movement began, in most developed countries we can adopt and marry and live normally in a way.
But people want to find something to still keep fighting for so trans issues it is. When they have more acceptance and bathroom laws etc. are the norm i think the shift will focus elsewhere.
I really hate how the new popular hashtag has become #blacktranslivesmatter
Like it really feels as if virtue signalers are just playing a bingo game to maximize the total number of woke points. It’s like those idiots who order the most expensive thing on the menu “because it has to be the best”. Anyone with a modicum of familiarity with blacks knows the black community is still extremely homophobic, with rampant toxic masculinity very prevalent (see: thug culture, worshipping rap and basketball idols, needing to be “tough” or “street”). But oh no, trannies have it the worst in America because we’ve done so much for regular homophobia that now it’s only retards who self inflict their own problems that we need to coddle. Let’s specifically point them out and make sure they get their own special spotlight. But fuck anyone who isn’t this unique rare subset of people. Gay Asians and bisexual Indians can go fuck themselves, because their lives aren’t as hard since they don’t commit a disproportionate amount of crime and try to cut off their dicks.
Honestly, I could see the more “regular” BLM protesters getting annoyed at this. None of the black people killed recently that people are protesting over have been trans. It’s really just a general, all-encompassing protest for black lives and anti police brutality—AND YET ONCE AGAIN, TRANNIES FEEL THE COMPULSION TO CARVE OUT THEIR OWN SPECIAL SOAPBOX AND MAKE SURE IT’’S ABOVE ALL THE REST
Like how do you think the family of George Floyd feels. The protest is centered around his unjust death at the hands of cops, and trannies need to shoehorn themselves in to look like the fucking coauthors of this whole movement
black trans people are such a minority that #blacktranslivesmatter derails #blacklivesmatter
>>55937>It’s really just a general, all-encompassing protest for black lives and anti police brutality
Well that's the cover story, yeah. It's more I just like to torch useless, economically draining, mismanaged cities. Check who runs the metropolises where these 'protests' are at their most intense. All retards.>Like how do you think the family of George Floyd feels.
How the relatives of a drugged-up, discount pornographer feel regarding his embarrassing, emasculating death? Most are dead, and their feelings wouldn't amount to anything regardless.
Valid points but this thread is for discussing how much we hate trannies.
By your own logic, then you are male.
I feel like the majority of trans women are indeed perverts who let their fetish take over their life but the ones who aren't are genuinely sick people who need help and compassion
Ok, but how do you create laws that assist the latter without enabling the former’s predatory traits? Clearly measures like therapy and counseling haven’t worked, when the drum they want to beat is “all trans women are valid, if you say you’re a woman then you’re a woman” and they act like the former doesn’t exist at all
>>55962>the ones who aren’t
dont exist, bye
You don't, I don't have an answer for it either. I feel like the sympathetic trannies, if they're out there, would not force themselves to be allowed into women's bathrooms etc but hey
I just feel bad for people with dysphoria I suppose, repressors are a good example of people who are just genuinely sick and need help
Not even 100 years ago consensus among psychiatrists was that female hysteria existed and that most mental health issues could be treated with a botched lobotomy. The field and it's understanding and guidelines is aways evolving wildly but you most likely won't see any progress made on this because no sane person will risk their careers by being shunned out for searching for a treatment beyond it.
It seems dumb to reshape society completely because of how gender dysphoria is treated now.
If it was just themselves that would be superb, but as a lesbo i can't even talk about how i don't like dick anymore because that's transphobic for example. Women's spaces like sports, shelters and scholarships are being given to trans women in detriment of cis ones, there is a huge push for gender neutral bathrooms when most cis women would feel uncomfortable with it, a law against FGM in the UK i believe was thrown away because of trans issues, ID cards doing away with sex to make them more comfortable, the fact that we have to police our language when talking about pregnancy or things like endometriosis now.
These things escalate and being labeled transphobic for inane shit like misgendering someone or saying sex exists can make you lose your job. For me it seems more and more like we are reshaping society to cater to trans/nb people. LGBs didn't have this kind or impact around your normal everyday person or laws.
Telling men that they need to stop watching porn or pretending that their striped socks are a sex characteristic is not conversion therapy. Converting their healthy reproductive systems into second assholes, complete with shitting, is conversion therapy.
>>55967>Ok, but how do you create laws that assist the latter without enabling the former’s predatory traits?
You severely underestimate the vetting process for getting hormones. Most first world countries nowadays do no formal screenings for the condition and just throw hormones at you if you tell them you identify as "X". The screening measures used to be more severe, but certain predatory ones you described are the ones who probably pushed for the immense lax in regulations involved in the process.
t. studied psychology in college before the rules changed>>55979>and that most mental health issues could be treated with a botched lobotomy.
Technically, they were correct, it's just that along with your mental illness you lost a lot of functions either. Cutting off the nose to spite the face and all that.
>It seems dumb to reshape society completely because of how gender dysphoria is treated now.
It's just one more step in the logical "progressive" stance where all identities are and must be made
equally valid. Just a symptom of an over socialized society.>>55983
What do you think conversion therapy is?
True.>this thread is for discussing how much we hate trannies.
Becky derailed with her current idolatry first.
How does it really affect us that moids take hormones and mutilate themselves?
Oh, I don’t care if trannies exist. Can’t speak for everyone here, but they have the right to castrate themselves if they want to, chemically or surgically.
What we take issue with is the demanding access to women’s spaces and and dominating conversations about women’s issues. Lesbians can’t even fuck exclusively women anymore without being called “transphobic” in some of these echo chambers.
This is the same line of thinking as “how does it affect me if people want to drunk drive and not wear face masks?” Actions in a society inevitably affect others. Live and let live is a nice sentiment but extremely naive. Maybe the action of a guy chopping off his dick doesn’t affect you, but what about when they want programs and aid meant for women redirected towards them? What about when they want to play in women’s competitive sports? Or when they demand access to women’s bathrooms, gynecologists, female shelters, female prisons, and women’s scholarships?
Please say this is one big joke and they're all just larping for the lolz.
It's all just a bad dream….go back to sleep..
What's cc's take on female trannies? I feel really bad for a lot of them tbh, the ones pretending to be gay men get no sympathy though.
I think those men are ill.
Whenever I feel insecure about my vagina I'll look at this picture.
Lots of transwomen I talked to are lolicons or have pedophilic tendencies. I wonder if that's some sort of a trend? Did any other anon experience this? It grosses me out. Even seemingly "non-predatory" trans women (like Digibro) are lolicons.>>59483
I'm fine with her if she presents as female in every part of her life. If she presents herself as female in video games, fiction, and refers to herself as female than she's fine. She has to be trutrans not AGP
True, even the non overtly pedophilic ones fetishize the shit out of the teenage girl "experience" and get upset at young girls for going through puberty
Yes, seen it too,an autistic weeb that dressed like Misty (really short high-waist shorts and small tanktops), with tons of make-up, violet hair, septum piercing and literally a pikachu-shaped phone case.
These are the exact two images that immediately come to mind whenever I hear troons shout "trans rights are human rights" or try to say that trans women are just as "valid" as cis women.
It fucking baffles me every time.
I can guarantee you that 99.9% of cis women associate PMS with misery and depression, and the bizarre <0.01% that fetishize it are lolcow-tier abnormal and creepy as shit.
Internet poisoning makes people think it's socially acceptable to be a pedophile.
>>59483>clit at the bottom
It's the least malpractice-tastic aspect of that chop job, but still, lol. What a basic thing to screw up.
No such thing. No trans people are valid or the gender that they claim to be. I don't care if a man ""presents as female.""
wait, digibro's a tranny nao?
Do a google search for "Digi-nee" if you want a laugh
Yeah. Watching his vids where he shows off his LO collection (infamous pedo magazine, kids all looking 10 at most) is so weird now. Good thing they probably won't have kids if he is on hrt, he won't hurt them at least.
Oh god that's actually vile anon, link me the video?
Why are trannies like this kek can't make this shit up
They’re an error on gods part
My identity is not defined by my vagina. Attached to my vagina is the "rest of the woman". So yes, I do consider them to be women. When I say that, I am not saying that there isn't any difference between me and a transwoman. Ofc there is a biological difference. But my experiences with men and transwomen is completely different. I don't feel unsafe, I don't feel like I'm talking to a disgusting man. I don't have any problem interacting with them that I would with a biological woman. So I wouldn't have any problem with them in female only spaces. Plus being in a male only/male dominated space is also very dangerous for them. I wish other ciswomen could understand that.
And I wish women like you would understand how stupid they are. But honestly you're probably just a troon so I'm not going to bother explaining anything.
And your personal experience gets to dictate women's feelings and experience because? Just make tranny-only spaces like women did when we felt unsafe with men.
No I'm not a troon. Plus it's just my own thoughts. I'm not enforcing them on you. If you hate transwomen then that's cool too but I'd just like to know why? What about your experiences?
No I'm not saying that my experiences are absolute and should dictate your life. If you feel unsafe with them then that's up to you. About women only spaces, I just wanna know how exactly are we gonna identify if a women is cis or trans? There are privileged transwomen like Blair White who do pass, what do we do in that situation? Does everyone need to go through a mandatory vagina check? What about the transwomen who've had bottom surgery? Are we going to womb scan???????
Blaire does not pass at all.
Only flattering angels, photoshop and make up make then look passable.
None of them act like a real woman and the "you probaly couldn't tell that one true trans woman apart from other woman" is not an option, because they don't pass.
No man, no matter how female he feels should be seen as one. No womam, no matter how male they feel.
We should accept who we are.
Fair enough. But I'd like to ask, what makes you a woman?
Being born female and experiencing sex based oppression
So does my gender identity of being female be celebrated by the amount of times I've been raped and discriminated against in male dominated spaces? Yes, I'm thankful for being born with a vagina but the instances of oppression that I've dealt with in my life made me want to kill myself for being a woman. You make being a woman sound like a chore. Sorry if I sound triggered, I just find it really upsetting.
Of course he kins little girls what a freak.
Nothing makes a woman. You are a woman.
You are born as a woman. You are an adult human female. That simply.
I never feel like a woman, never ever.
Does this make me less then a woman?
No, I am still a woman. Do i feel happy in my body? No.
But I am still a woman.
You can't become a woman.
Does this makes sense? I am bad with words.
Not sure what you’re saying with all that ESL. That’s just reality, being a woman fucking sucks. No matter how much you hate it or try to run away from it, it will never the change the fact that a woman gets raped and abused because she was born into a world that thinks her lesser because of her sex. This begins the moment she is born. A man will never understand this by putting on a dress.>>59585
Yes it makes sense. Women never wake up and think about how they feel like a woman, They just ARE, I just am.
Uh huh. It's Ms. Terf to you. You're making so much progress fighting for twans right on an obscure imageboard. So brave and stunning. Dilate.
I am so fucking sick how every place wants to protect trannys at all costs. Places like lolcow are nor spaces where you cant say jack shit about fucking trannys or else you get banned. WTF it wasnt like this years ago, did a tranny join the mod team or what
all reddit spaces for women are getting the banhammer too. I am sick of it SICK OF IT
no. the answer is simple: when an individual "comes out" as transgender, we save a LOT of headache by offing them quickly & without ceremony.
>>59594>did a tranny join the mod team
this is how they operate yes, they can also have trans orbiters in their modteam which has the same effect, anything for their lady(male)
at this point because of how much the server has been shared, its a more tranny chan than real woemen chan.
it just really sucks how we cant have a place just for ourselves. troons obviously go through life in a different way than women do. we aren’t the same and thats perfectly fine. why do they constantly try to force their way into spaces that aren’t for them????
Girls, we're all girls in the end of the day. Let's get along, STOP BEING SEXIST and finally getting a boyfriend.
just 41 already you disgusting abomination
at this age.
You need a life.
YouTube recommended me this video about transwomen in sports.
a troon "lesbian" acquaintance of mine thinks me calling men "scotes" is funny. you ARE the scrote.
I saw this on a ftm trans sub on reddit. Gosh, that's just depressing. Why do they keep chasing that dream? Deep down they know they won't ever be men.
It is false to claim transgenders are over represented for suicide due to discrimination when you look at the suicide rates for jews living under Nazi rule.https://cdn.doctorsonly.co.il/2018/01/hOLOCAUST-sUICIDE-PSYCH-RESEARCH.pdf
I see this argument a lot and when you do the fact checking it is simply false.
I imagine transwoman mostly believe this total meme and it causes a negative perception of cis people.
What harm would be done by saying transgender people do actually have a higher rate of suicide due to being men deluding themselves into wnating to be woman or gender dysphoria being a mental illness (still in the DSM last time I check but not next edition I bet).
Would we not be able to offer transgender people more help if we as a society admitted they just tend to kill themselves more because they are transgender?
I hardly think TERFs opinions are worse than nazi discrimination and policies.
I would say that I do, I've had fine experiences with them in all honesty. Most people who don't consider them women in this thread seem to just have had shit experiences with them, so I get where they are coming from.
Also three year old thread, jesus
it really bothers me that the admins allow this on the site at all
not me, eat shit filthy scrote troon.
YOU WILL NEVER BE A WOMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
just look for the adam's apple