Honest Question Anonymous 98526
I've seen some studies posit 50% abuse rates for lesbian relationships. I think those numbers are way too high, but even the lowest I can find still put it at 17%. Has anyone here ever been in an abusive lesbian relationship?
This is probably going to stir some shit, but those numbers seem fake and I don't know how else to broach the subject.
>>98526>Has anyone here ever been in an abusive lesbian relationship?
Why would you use anecdotal evidence rather than the data from studies?>I think those numbers are way too high
So you're seeking validation from any other source?
I don't know, I'd imagine a place with a lot of self-identified lesbians might be able to provide some real stories. Finding lesbian abuse stories are rare as far as I can tell.
Not a lesbian, but I've known two lesbian couples throughout my life.
First one had two kids. One of the mother shoved semen up there twice (or however they do it). Because she was the biological mother of the kids (while both were legal parents), she'd use that as leverage to act as "their real mother" and torment her partner. They eventually split up.
The other couple was pure physical and verbal abuse. One was fairly tall and large while the other was barely 5 feet tall.
Those are my anecdotal evidences. From my experience, 100% of lesbian couples have some sort of domestic abuse. Does that mean 100% of lesbian couples have domestic abuse? No. If I were to give you two opposite stories instead, would that mean domestic abuse in lesbian couples don't exist? Neither.
Anecdotal evidence is garbage.>>98566
My point is that they are far more reliable than anecdotal evidences.
I’m going to be fucking retarded here for a second and post my lecture about this. Most studies like this are difficult to replicate. It would be even harder to replicate now for real lesbians due to transbians and such. But let’s assume it’s right: 50% of lesbians experience domestic abuse. Data without context is useless so let’s add ways to interpret these findings.
The typical lesbian counterargument:
1. Women gets in abusive relationship with moid
2. Gets abused, either due to their homosexuality or moid is just trash
3. Gets out and starts identifying as lesbian
The study isn’t trash and only included abuse that only occurred in a wlw relationship by a partner that identified as a lesbian:
1. Gay women are marginalized by society
2. People marginalized by society are much easier to isolate/abuse because they actually have no support system
3. Abusive lizbean (with her own trauma) finds other lizbean (who may become a coabuser) and does an abusive relationship
If none of these interpretations work you can turn your inner moid on for this interpretation:
1. Women more likely to report being abuse in a relationship
2. Relationship between two women exists
3. Twice the abuse reports
At the end of the day, the reason why these results were found is is not important to me. I’ve only dated men and will probably die without having been in a relationship with a woman. The only way to prevent being hurt is never entering into a relationship regardless of the sex of your partner. However, when moids bring it up is it’s a way to invalidate lesbians and by extension women in general. Know what men are trying to say about women when the 50% number comes up.
Men love to imagine abusive lesbians because it gives them a boner. That's really all it is.
they are fake. you probably missed some detail in those studies (like sampling, perpetrator - moid or not, what type of violence - psychological/verbal or physical, etc). like that one study that infamously reported lesbians having the highest rate of dv had such results because it included male not-intimate-partner violence into its statistics. but considering the violence that was done by intimate partners (female) only lesbians had the lowest rate of all. so i guess the statistics you provide has the same problem (give the sources btw, do you think we are going to beleive your claims without any evidence or what?)
This doesn't account for lesbian women reporting having both male and female perpetrators of intimate partner violence.
That said, what's the actual source of this study ? It probably contains interesting details on how the samples were chosen.
You can't multiply those numbers together they are unrelated. The first (2/3rds) is the number of lesbians that have had female only violence. That's the number with men removed already.
The latter is severe physical violence.
To assume that implies only 19.82% of them experienced it from females based on the other fact is wrong. It could be all 29% experienced it from female partners or zero. You can't assume the ratio there, and knowing what we know about men I'm not going so say the numbers can safely be multiplied to find an equal ratio
TLDR: The number of "severe physical violence" from female only couples is probably far lower than the 19%
A sample of 162 gay males and 111 lesbians (N = 273) completed a survey measuring the frequency of sexually coercive acts occurring within gay and lesbian relationships.
Participants were asked to indicate: the most extreme unwanted sexual behavior that had occurred with a lesbian or gay partner; how many and what kind of tactics from 12 listed were used in each instance of coercion.
About 52% of participants reported at least one incident of sexual coercion. Lesbians reported 1.2 incidents on average. Coerced kissing was reported by 18% of lesbians. Coerced fondling was described by 32% of lesbians. About 50% of lesbians reported unwanted penetration or genital fondling. The four most commonly reported tactics for lesbians were: persistent touching (42%), guilt-tripping (24%), telling lies (21%), and alcohol or drugs (19%). Other tactics were mentioned by less than 10% of participants.
Waldner-Haugrud, Lisa K., & Vaden Gratch, Linda. (1997). Sexual coercion in gay/lesbian relationships: Descriptives and gender differences. Violence and Victims, 12 (1), 87-98.https://www.researchgate.net/publication/13870138_Sexual_Coercion_in_GayLesbian_Relationships_Descriptives_and_Gender_Differences
I think this is the study that everyone uses to talk about the high abuse rates of lesbian relationships:
>Nineteen studies describing either prevalence or correlates of same-sex domestic violence were reviewed and critiqued to review what is known about psychological, physical, and sexual violence in same-sex relationships and to compare findings with partner abuse in heterosexual relationships.
>Comparisons by type of couple showed that 28% of heterosexual couples, 48% of lesbians and 38% of gay male couples reported physical abuse in one study, but the amount of physical force used was low for all groups. In a study asking about whether a same-sex relationships had suffered from physical abuse, 7% of 706 lesbian couples and 11% of 560 gay men couples indicated physical abuse had occurred. In studies using only lesbian couples, psychological abuse was reported as occurring at least one time by 73% to 90% of lesbians. More than 30% of lesbians had been in a same-sex relationship where at least one physical incident occurred. One study of treatment of lesbian batterers has been done. Average length of treatment was one year, with abusive behaviors decreasing within 4 to 6 weeks of treatment.
Burke, Leslie K., & Follingstad, Diane R. (1999). Violence in lesbian and gay relationships: theory, prevalence, and correlational factors. Clinical Psychology Review, 19 (5), 487-512.
i agree, they didnt differentiate between the degrees of violence, most likely lesbian violence is less severe than heterosexual one (and het women are less likely to report mild forms of abuse because they think that such behaviour is normal for men). thats what i meant here >>98645
by saying that details from study change the statistic drastically. the myth of eeeevil lesbians is the result of misinterpretation and concealment of important data.
>The reported rates of physical violence within lesbian relationships vary widely, with estimates ranging from a low of 8.5% to a high of 73% in former lesbian relationships. Most studies found that between 30-40% of surveyed participants had been involved in at least one relationship with a female partner where an incident of physical abuse occurred. >Pushing, shoving, and slapping were the most commonly reported forms of abuse, while beatings and assaults with weapons were less frequent. >Victimization rates increased dramatically when psychological and verbal abuse was assessed, with more than 80% of surveyed participants reporting this form of abuse. >A lesbian batterer can use homophobic control as a method of psychological abuse, which further isolates the victim. For example, an abuser may “out” her partner without permission by revealing her sexual orientation to others, including relatives, employers, and landlords, and in child custody cases.>Researchers and members of law enforcement may falsely believe that violence is enacted by the partner who is more “masculine” in appearance or demeanor, while the victim possesses more “feminine” characteristics. The research dispels this myth.>Lesbian victims also must contend with the myth of mutual battering. A lesbian victim may be quiet, withdrawn, and embarrassed, particularly if she has defended herself or fought back. Although she may blame herself, further questioning reveals that what appears to be “mutual abuse” is actually the victim’s efforts to secure her personal safety, as opposed to hurting her partner. >The centrality of bars in the social lives of some lesbians, coupled with societal discrimination that fosters alienation and isolation, may contribute to both heavy drinking and partner violence. Not surprisingly, other researchers discovered that the frequency of alcohol use by respondents was correlated with the number of abusive acts that were both perpetrated and sustained in lesbian relationships.
I believe the study you're talking about used a lot of women who identified as a lesbian after being in an abusive relationship with a man, however I could see where the confusion could come from, since there's much less lesbian relationships
>If there's only 30 lesbian relationships in a town, then 5 abusive relationships is like 10%
>If there's 100 straight relationships and 5 are abusive it's only 5%
You're definitely right though I haven't met a single person in an abusive lesbian relationship despite the fact I frequent and keep up with the community
107 lesbians in Arizona were surveyed about their history of victimization and use of aggression (sexual, verbal/emotional, and physical) and their perceptions about whether their current or past relationships would be described as abusive. Participants were from 21-59 years of age, with 50% being under 34 years old.
Many lesbians had witnessed or experienced aggression by family members (56%) or by previous male partners (65%).
At least one aggressive act had occurred in past lesbian relationships for 73% of participants. Of these, the most common was verbal/emotional aggression (65%), followed by sexual (57%) and physical (45%). However, only 51% perceived a past relationship as being abusive.
About 25% reported some kind of aggression in their current lesbian relationship. Of these, the most common was verbal/emotional aggression (24%), followed by physical (12%) and sexual (9%). However, only 10% perceived the current relationship as abusive.
About 33% reported using aggression against a previous male partner; 68% said they had used some kind of aggression (usually verbal/emotional) against a past female partner; and 22% indicated initiating some form of aggression against a current female partner.
Lie, Gwat-Yong, & Gentlewarrier, Sabrina. (1991). Intimate violence in lesbian relationships: Discussion of survey findings and practice implications. Journal of Social Service Research, 15 (1/2), 41-59.
It's most likely true. Why?
When only taking non-reciprocal domestic violence into account, women outnumber men as the perpetrators 2:1 in heterosexual relationships.
Working hypothesis: Women are on average more aggressive and violent in relationships than men are, and heterosexual statistics, gay and lesbian statistics, all reflect that, with gay relationships having the lowest reported incidence of violent abuse, and lesbian relationships the highest incidence of violent abuse.
Criminal statistics don't reflect this compared to surveys that simply ask people, as a man in a heterosexual relationship will usually get arrested when the woman beating him breaks a nail.
Inb4 deleted for harsh truths
And of course men are much more violent overall than women, but their violence mostly targets other men, people outside the home. Meanwhile, female violence overwhelmingly targets people inside the home, family, children, spouses.
Almost every study posted here has been over 20 years old.
this is obvious, there is a big stigma on men hitting women because men are much stronger. men are also more likely to be aggressors in non-violent ways, such as being controlling, standing in her way, not letting her leave, etc. men are more likely to exaggerate violence and women to downplay
might not apply to that study but violent men will also pretend that they are the calm one who is being attacked when the police come and the upset woman who was just within an inch of being murdered comes across as the aggressor.
people who say men are easily arrested for claims of DV have never encountered DV personally.
>>98884>men are more likely to exaggerate violence and women to downplay
Ding ding ding.
Good analysis. Moids obsessed with statistics very rarely, if ever, have any interest in digging into the complicated network of root causes behind the pithy number.
The way I see it is that it doesn't matter to me, personally.
Maybe it's true for various reasons brought up here, but I'd rather be punched or groped by a woman than a man. I'm quite sturdy and prefer smaller partners, so unless weapons are involved it's not as scary for a 5'3" woman to come swinging at me compared to a man even of the same size.
Any percentage is a chance for violence to occur. I'd at least like to be able to handle it easily if it does.
When statistics are done on women, they include MTF people as "women". Most MTFaggots are """transbians""". Interesting how the statistics for women caught in sex abuse crimes has had an uptick that people are using as an example of why women are awful, but when you actually look at a breakdown of the numbers women have not started to suddenly become violent rapists, more that violent rapists have started to buy bolt ons and become fake women. Lesbian relationship abuse statistics are influenced by troons in a similar fashion
Even before what I said above, the lesbians in question were still counted as abused if it were a previous moid partner. So not even all the lesbians in abusive relationships were abused by lesbian partners.
It sounds like you'd be the hypothetical abuser in the relationship then, wouldn't? If you're finding security in being the larger partner, doesn't that mean by definition your smaller partner can not find that same security?
>Noooooo they cant be men are demons women are angels.
Since anecdotal evidence is the new fact:
I have met three butch lesbians that were abusive as fuck to their current GF and they tried that with me too (while in a relationship) as act of hitting on me. They were everything this board describes as moids.
My mother, the mother of my childhood friend and the mother of My current GF were all outright violent. Not "My evil racist Nazi mom used the wrong pronouns for my trans anime persona" abusive but belt with brass buckle in your face for bad grades and throwing liquor bottles after their husbands levels of abuse.
Most based reply ITT, at the end of the day I don't really care though if the statistics for this are true, males still commit most crimes and are scummy in nature.
Well, I would hope someone out there is different than myself and is able to trust a big gf. Luckily this seems to be the case. I would also do all I could to comfort them and show that I would never hurt anyone.
I was just offering my "strategy" for anons who have intense phobias about (gay?) intimate partner violence. But a lot of my interest is also unrelated to that. I've always liked size difference, perhaps because it allows me to do certain acts of service (lifting things, opening things, etc.). I like to feel useful.
It's still a big challenge for anons who exclusively like tall/muscular people. You guys will have to fully work through the phobia emotionally in order to date, and that sucks. Every miner likely has other mental health issues on top of this to deal with.
>>98884>might not apply to that study but violent men will also pretend that they are the calm one who is being attacked when the police come and the upset woman who was just within an inch of being murdered comes across as the aggressor.
To be honest I would guess that this could go both ways depending on the character of the people involved and how nasty they're feeling.
Yeah it's weird how butch lesbians emulate men like what's the point of you dating a butch lesbian if they're still gonna behave like moids?