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Anonymous 4376

Any good books about witchcraft and occultism? And something in the spirit of Pseudomonarchia Daemonum?

Anonymous 4377

Occultism is kind of gay but when I went through that phase I read "Deeper into the Underworld" By Chris Allaun and remember really liking it, his other books look neat too. I remember reading a book called "The Green Witch" by something Hiscock? (forget the name).
That was interesting but kind of cheesy.
I also read the Satanic Bible a couple weeks ago and that one was really fucking ridiculous, I dare you not to laugh when you read what he describes as the satanic ritual.
Internet Sacred Texts archive has lots if books on occultism and other religions, check that out too.

Anonymous 4378

>>4377
I should add that the first part of the satanic bible was good, but the second half when he deacribes the magic just makes me cringe so hard.

Anonymous 4379

>>4377
Thanks but what do you mean by calling it gay?

Anonymous 4380


Anonymous 4382

>>4379
>>4379
Pseudo-truth more based off of a desire to have power and truth without actually having to adhere to the prinicpals of a religion. Ever wonder why teenagers, the most powerless demographic, is the people it appeals to the most?Because it promises a lot of power with little actual work. People believe in it because they want to, not because they believe it. Anton LeVay even said that you should pick something already likely to happen if you cast a spell lol, basicay acknowledging its about creating a false sense of power and not actually causing something to happen.

This is what most "witches" are like:

https://youtu.be/dp5omkBWw88

Its a religion to pretend the powerless have power, or for people who REALLY wish they were Nancy Downs.

Anonymous 4383

>>4380
This seems interesting but the website design is fucking killing me. It looks like they didn't give a shit about changing/improving it since it's creation, and the papyrus font header… no comment.

Anonymous 4384

>>4382
I thought being gay means you want to fuck someone who has the same genitalia as you

What you've just described can be applied to lots of different things because people strive to have more power/control in their lives
For me it just seems like a form of artistic outlet more than anything else, it's interesting to read about just like tolkien or lovecraft work is, but that's just me I guess.

Anonymous 4385

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>>4384
>I thought being gay means you want to fuck someone who has the same genitalia as you
What?!?! I thought gay meant lame?? When I was growing up gay meant lame and now it means guy who has sex with another guy??

A lot of queer kids are into witchcraft though.

>What you've just described can be applied to lots of different things because people strive to have more power/control in their lives

Yeah it can and it does, witchcraft is as Uncle Ted would call it, a "surrogate activity". Many people seek more power in many ways, because the system strips them of their power. Doesn't really make witchcraft any less fake, but you do you.

Anonymous 4386

>>4383
Its a neat website, at least for finding interesting texts you can download elsewhere.
I attempted to email that guy who runs it and he never responded so I doubt he's still actively involved in it. The last update was from like 2008.
It doesnt bother me really, I like the "old internet" feel. I mean, imageboard design is outdated on most.

Anonymous 4387

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>>4385
Everything is fake these days it seems

Anonymous 4388

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>>4382
Occultism isn't a religion, it's essentially an umbrella term for various beliefs, practices and rituals involving forces which fall outside the realm of traditional science or religion.

As far as believing in something because you want to believe in it, rather than because you actually believe in it, I think this is a very interesting point. Do you think a Christian with above average intelligence believes, literally, that Christ turned water to wine? What would it mean for someone to believe in the doctrine of Christ, to believe in the power of the religious texts, yet deny that water could physically be turned to wine (for example)?

In my opinion, these people feel something resonating within themselves which goes beyond the surface-level drama of the text. This is reinforced in their minds by various religious rituals, religious singing, evangelising, and so on. Yet at the end of the day, any religious person who is sufficiently mature and intelligent will acknowledge, on some level, that they continue to believe because they want to continue to believe. The same is true for any genuinely held spiritual belief, be it occult or otherwise. The specific content of the text isn't so much what matters, but rather the spiritual ethos which underlies the text, and the philosophical conclusions drawn from the text by the reader. If these conclusions are agreeable to them, then continuing with the appropriate rituals acts as a sort of meditation on or fortification of the belief itself.

Anonymous 4389

>>4388
>occultism isn't a religion, it's essentially an umbrella term for various beliefs, practices and rituals involving forces which fall outside the realm of traditional science or religion.
I understand what occultism is, most occultists don't adhere to the teachings of a religion because they don't want truth, they want a sense of truth and power so they read about bullshit topics that have so little to them. It functions the same as religion for its practicioners, though even the practitioners themselves recognize its so loose it can't be called a religion. What people look for in occultism is the same as what they look for in religion, but it isn't a religion. Most of it is so blatently fake and stupid, but they choose to ignore this because, "it would be so cool if I could cast spells and shit like Harry Potter."

>As far as believing in something because you want to believe in it, rather than because you actually believe in it, I think this is a very interesting point. Do you think a Christian with above average intelligence believes, literally, that Christ turned water to wine? What would it mean for someone to believe in the doctrine of Christ, to believe in the power of the religious texts, yet deny that water could physically be turned to wine (for example)?

A christian perspective, Christ was not man but God. God can do anything and doesn't have to adhere to the rules of the physical world like mortals do. This being said, if they truely believe in God it doesn't matter that it makes no sense,because god transcends the physical and his miracles and nature don't have to make sense to mortals. They weren't there to witness this event, so they can't say otherwise.
Christians do actively have to convice themselves, often times they'll talk about losing their faith and having to pray to renew it. So they do choose.
I believe the purpose of other religions is much more productive though. Religion was created to give man purpose and calm his existential fears (caused by sentience) and to keep order so society can function.
Both sentience and civilization are crimes and anomolies, nature's mistake. They shouldn't ever have existed, so you need a new force to help enforce them, and that is what religion does.
Religion's intention was always to unite (though often it divides), and has united many civilizations over the years, and religion was even enforced by law in many cases.
Occultism is so loose it can't unite, it doesn't encourage order to help a civilization function, and often times doesn't even provide purpose because of lack of belief in something higher than the physical, but just OUTSIDE of the physical.

Its interesting to read about and fantasize about, but as a religion its sub-par. Occult ideas is what you choose to believe in after you realize Santa Clause was just mommy all along, and one day you'll leave it behind too.

Anonymous 4391

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Can this stop being a debate thread? Can someone actually recommend books or discuss them here instead of arguing how bullshit or childish occultism is?

Anonymous 4392

>>4389
You acknowledge that "occultism" as a word refers to various disparate beliefs, yet you seem happy to generalise them all. Not all occultists/esotericists are Wiccans or LaVeyan Satanists. I agree that many people who might consider themselves occultists have half-baked ideas and are more interested in aesthetics than in philosophy. But these people can't be taken to represent all occultists. Not all occult systems of belief are woefully underdeveloped.

>Religion was created to give man purpose and calm his existential fears

I'd agree with this, though I might take issue with the idea that religion was "created". However I think that any number of ideologies or philosophies can provide a person with a sense of purpose, including political, religious and occult beliefs. Whether or not you or I agree with the doctrines underlying these beliefs is irrelevant, they provide a sense of purpose nonetheless.

>Both sentience and civilization are crimes and anomolies, nature's mistake. They shouldn't ever have existed

This is a matter of personal belief, clearly.

>…so you need a new force to help enforce them

Why? This seems like a bit of a leap in logic. There's no reason to prefer this to, for example, aiming for the destruction of all sentient life and civilisation, or simply accepting the absurd nature of reality. Again, this is your personal belief. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but it's a belief, and clearly one which underlies your worldview. There are different beliefs which underlie certain occult worldviews which are radically different to your own.

>Occultism is so loose it can't unite

Yes, naturally. Occultism is not a religion. Perhaps the goal of Satanism is to "unite", or perhaps the goal of Thelema is to "unite". But occultism has no goal, because people who would be called occultists have very different goals. They don't all share a single belief system. This would have made more sense if you had clarified exactly which occult beliefs you're referring to.

>it doesn't encourage order to help a civilization function

Again, this depends on which particular occult beliefs you're referring to. However as far as I'm aware, most fleshed out occult belief systems have a distinct focus on the self, and many of those which are concerned with human civilisation (or the physical world in general) promote what most people would call a nihilistic or misanthropic point of view, or quite literally a "return to chaos". In these cases you'd be correct. To practitioners of these beliefs, encouraging order is precisely the opposite of their goal.

Anonymous 4394

>>4392
It is a matter of personal belief, and the majority of occultists are as you described, and its the brand of occultism that I dislike for the reasons I stated:
>many people who might consider themselves occultists have half-baked ideas and are more interested in aesthetics than in philosophy.
That brand of occultism, most occultism, is for children and for people who want cheap religion with nearly no purpose. That kind of loose belief happens to be the least strong and most absurd of all religions, reflecting the intelligence of the practitioners, another reason it appeals to kids. Most of them even recognize how false it is, like Satanists. Satanic magic as depicted in the Satanic bible reads like a shitpost.
>>4391
I can't think of any other occult books I read, but if I remember any more I'll post.

Anonymous 4538

>>4394
Most occultists aren't children, you're just a retard who think that occultism is for le edgy teenagoors. Occultism and occultists are no more or less pathetic than any other theists or pagans.



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